Xlerator Hand Dryers Need to Be Banned!

Discussion in 'Support' started by Alue, Jul 3, 2016.

tinnitus forum
    1. Alue

      Alue Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      01/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      I'm talking about these evil bastards:

      Too Loud Hand Dryer

      (not my video)

      They can exceed 90db and are painfully loud to already damaged ears. I just went to a restroom where I didn't realize one was on the wall. Whenever I hear these go off I have to just stop what I'm doing and put my hands over my ears. People look at me like I'm a lunatic and continue on but they just don't fucking get it.
       
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    2. LeQuack
      Scared

      LeQuack Member Benefactor

      Location:
      United States of Europe
      Tinnitus Since:
      2005
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Bad luck and bad genes
      Yeah they're quite loud, not as loud as Dyson ones they have in some bathrooms. I can't stand those, so loud.

      NoiseHealth_2015_17_75_90_153394_b1.jpg
       
    3. QuiEt WaTeRS

      QuiEt WaTeRS Member

      Location:
      Minnesota
      Tinnitus Since:
      4/1997
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      rock concerts (perhaps additional factors add to it)
      I agree. I try my best to not go in restrooms with those things. If I did and I happened to be using a urinal and one of those dryers (or any loud hand dryer) came on I would plug my ears with my fingers/hands and let the stream go wherever it may. I can rule out working at any job where the restroom has those installed (which I recently did). There are so many products out there that are louder than they ever need to be!!!
       
    4. Alue

      Alue Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      01/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      Keep in mind these decibel levels are provided from the manufacturer in "normal" conditions, i.e. not putting your hands 1 inch away from the air jet.

      This site has them at 95db.
      http://www.restroomdirect.com/hand-dryer-noise-levels.aspx
      I have measured it (not standing next to the dryer) and it was over 90db.

      This site: http://acoustics.org/pressroom/httpdocs/159th/fullerton.htm
      has some of the older models between 89 and 100 dbA. 100 db is way too loud.
       
    5. Foncky
      Doubtful

      Foncky Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Europe
      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2004
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      An explosion, music, and fate.
      Yeah these things are so stupid.
      Noise is not always a concern for engineers... I even think there's a purpose : "Do you hear that man ? It's fucking loud, right ? That means it works, your hands are so nice now, and that was fast !".

      You're not so you don't care ;)
       
    6. Engineer
      Creative

      Engineer Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1/20/15
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Most likely acoustic hearing loss
      I agree, they suck. I suffered mildy from H, and hated those f*ckers with a passion when I first came down with this condition. I would be in a stall or at a urinal 10 feet away covering my ears. I can tolerate them from a distance now but still hate them. I still wipe my hands on my pants rather than invoking one of those sound demons.
       
    7. glynis-harbron
      Feminine

      glynis-harbron Member Benefactor Hall of Fame Ambassador Team Awareness Team Research

      Location:
      England, Stoke-on-Trent
      Tinnitus Since:
      2004
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Meniere's Disease
      To strong now even use as a hairdryer when caught out in the rain going the pub....enough to cause damadge now so keeping ears well away:eek:......lots of love glynis
       
    8. Telis

      Telis Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Calgary
      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      These driers are not loud to a healthy ear, neither are screaming kids, barking dogs etc. It's just tiny percentage of the population that would have a problem with a little hair drier noise. I think those of us with ear issues loose touch with reality at times.
       
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    9. Alue

      Alue Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      01/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      I don't know.

      Maybe not dangerously loud for a short time, but I have talked with a number of people that have 'healthy' ears that think they are too loud.
       
    10. Foncky
      Doubtful

      Foncky Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Europe
      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2004
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      An explosion, music, and fate.
      Noise is a major source of stress for people. Stress is a major cause of disease. Ears are not the only problem.

      Unnecessary noises like that are just... unnecessary and awful. It's 2016, it should be possible to perfectly clean our hands in silence.

      Maybe our whole society looses touch with reality at times, believing that constant loud noise is something natural.
       
    11. Telis

      Telis Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Calgary
      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      I guess I was way out of touch with reality then, never in my life have I felt stressed about drying my hands prior to my ear injury.

      Maybe we should ban kids as well? Im sure a lot of parents are way out of touch with reality and don't understand that their screaming kids can be as loud as a hand drier.
       
      • Funny Funny x 1
    12. Richard zurowski

      Richard zurowski Member Benefactor

      Location:
      England
      Tinnitus Since:
      27/12/2012
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear infection.
      @Telis . I agree on that . Screaming children are my worst nightmare. That and screaming police cars. Fire trucks. And ambulances.
       
    13. Vaba
      Shitfaced

      Vaba Member

      Location:
      New New York
      Tinnitus Since:
      Unknown
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown. Gradual, Progressive
      I don't think they're bad. I use them all the time. I actually quite like how quickly they dry my hands, I can get back to what I was doing without having to wait an eternity for the dryer to heat up. Plus, dryers save a ton of paper.

      Do you have hyperacusis?
       
    14. Vaba
      Shitfaced

      Vaba Member

      Location:
      New New York
      Tinnitus Since:
      Unknown
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown. Gradual, Progressive
      Also, I should add that I don't consider my ears to be damaged. I can deal with loud noises pretty well provided they are safe for the period of exposure I have (including 120dB explosive fireworks, cannons and guns, I love the 4th of July). My hearing threshold is 0-10dB, but I have killer T and used to have H.

      These dryers are loud, but safe for the period of exposure you have. 85-90dB is reasonably safe for 30 minutes to 8 hours depending on your individual situation and the acoustics of the bathroom. I don't think I've ever dried my hands for over a half hour :cool:
       
    15. Foncky
      Doubtful

      Foncky Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Europe
      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2004
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      An explosion, music, and fate.
      You don't need to be so literal :D
      You know it's not something like : "Oh, this thing is noisy, I'm feeling stressed now !".

      It's just that if you add the constant loud noise (transports, traffic, loud music in the shops, movies, professional exposure even when you work in an office, of course hand dryers !, etc) to the numerous sources of stress we all face daily in our fast-paced world, you're just more stressed and more tired. And most people don't realize that until they cut some noise from their lives. I read more and more scientific studies about the consequences of noise on the human body and mind. This field of study is new but fascinating.

      Kids are not hand dryers, come on ;)
      They are precious as they are and screaming is an essential part of their development. For most parents, the joy of hearing their kids screaming goes beyond everything, so that's all cool.

      I don't care if we ban noisy hand dryers. Is their noise a possible source of positive emotion ? No. We will always find ways to make very efficient AND silent ones. I'd be concerned if we banned kids ;)

      But if you're really interested in the noise produced by kids : yes, screams are a major cause of stress and tiredness for school teachers.
       
    16. quietatnight
      Frustrated

      quietatnight Member

      Location:
      Rockford IL
      Tinnitus Since:
      1990
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Accustic tramma due being too close to a fire craker when I was a kid
      Vaba

      You claim to have tinnitus, but after reading your post, I have a hard time believing that you have any clue what "Intrusive bad" tinnitus even is. Most people with loud tinnitus can NOT go near,,, " 120 dB explosive fireworks, cannons and guns," I personally stay indoors with all of my windows closed every 4th. The Golden rule that "you have to be exposed to 85 DB for 8 hours to do ear damage " Does NOT apply to people with pre damaged ears PERIOD.

      I'm sorry but I just had to say something here, I have been reading about people claiming that they are suffering from Bad "intrusive" tinnitus that still continue to go to VERY LOUD Rock Concerts, loud bars, play with fireworks and even shoot off guns for fun ??? That's just insane,,, they are asking for a life time of horrible suffering, and I just don't understand that ? and I never will. They must have just "garden variety tinnitus" that is only heard in very quiet places. FOR NOW



      Louie

      Quietatnight
       
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    17. linearb
      Psychedelic

      linearb Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      East Coast USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      1998
      @Telis I saw a study indicating that pediatricians have more hearing loss than other doctors. so, little kids definitely are "too" loud. It hasn't stopped me from trying to have some, though ;)

      The noise level of the modern world is absolutely having a negative health effect on most people; just because they're mostly unaware of it, doesn't negate that. in the 1930s people used beauty cream with radium in it...
       
    18. Vaba
      Shitfaced

      Vaba Member

      Location:
      New New York
      Tinnitus Since:
      Unknown
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown. Gradual, Progressive
      Quote my post next time so I can tell when you are talking to me without checking the thread, please!

      I can hear (and feel) my T literally 100% of the time, no matter where I am, so I consider it to be intrusive. I can be in the shower, outside, talking to a friend, working, at the mall, or blasting music into my ears; my left ear in particular produces this tonal noise all the time. Fans, AC, music, etc. does not cover it up. My left ear hurts a lot too! It feels horribly pressurized, full, numb, and "dead."

      I can hear the quietest whisper in either ear. I can make out conversations on the phone - both the person talking near me, and the person on the other end of the line. My hearing is VERY sensitive. Despite this, I still suffer.

      The left ear continues to screech at an indefinable tone regardless of what I do. The ear does not receive sound correctly as well. If I play a song from a speaker directly in front of me, I will hear it in my right ear VERY loudly compared to my left ear. My left eardrum does not vibrate and respond properly to the sound. I don't feel any physical "sensation" in my left ear when there's sound, the ear is really numb and doesn't react properly. It's hard to explain...

      I think you are too quick to bunch tinnitus and hyperacusis together; I think that you believe that you can't have T without also having H & being afraid of loud noise. Just because someone's ears are damaged doesn't mean they HAVE to ALWAYS avoid loud noise. Loud noise is a part of life. Personally, I seem to have JUST hearing loss and tinnitus with NO hyperacusis or misophonia (fear of loud noise). Most people are able to expose themselves to extremely loud noise for extended periods (think about the 100 million Americans who go to concerts regularly), WE (tinnitus patients) are the minority.

      To summarize, I can hear my T basically anywhere I go, and my left ear hurts/feels "full" 24/7. However, I don't feel anxious about the need to protect myself from safe noises. Even noises of 109dB are safe for 2 minutes, according to dangerousdecibels.org, which is a VERY conservative hearing loss site. So, if I'm exposed to a blasting motorcycle at work for a few minutes, I don't lose my cool, because I know it can't hurt me.

      Sure enough, my bad T hasn't gotten worse so far...
       
      • Informative Informative x 1
    19. linearb
      Psychedelic

      linearb Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      East Coast USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      1998
      most people with T that I've found on motorcycle forums and musician forums have the same view you do, @Vaba - the tremendous spectrum of responses that different people have to head noise are pretty fascinating.
       
    20. cantbelieveit

      cantbelieveit Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      Forever
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Not sure
      the moment you realize your world has shrunk: you spend half your waking day discussing statistics and effects of hand dryers..........
       
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    21. quietatnight
      Frustrated

      quietatnight Member

      Location:
      Rockford IL
      Tinnitus Since:
      1990
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Accustic tramma due being too close to a fire craker when I was a kid
      Vaba

      I'm happy that you feel you can do anything that you want and seem to not care if you push the envelope at any DB level without fear of damaging your hearing and tempting fate. I wish I had that ability, but I DO NOT, and I have chosen a different path, I guess we are all different. I have a couple of Specific frequencies that WILL damage my ears even at very low DB levels. I believe that you exposing your ears to DB levels over 100 is totally unnecessary and really pushing your luck, and it's only a matter of time before your luck will run out.

      I am going to continue to do whatever I can to protect my ears so I can keep my tinnitus as low as I can, as long as I can. and keep my hearing.

      But I do respect your opinion.


      Louie

      Quietatnight

       
    22. Vaba
      Shitfaced

      Vaba Member

      Location:
      New New York
      Tinnitus Since:
      Unknown
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown. Gradual, Progressive
      @linearb @quietatnight @cantbelieveit

      Just to be totally clear - I'm not AT ALL saying that you SHOULD expose yourself to noises in excess of 85dB all the time. Exposure to loud noise will eventually cause damage. I'm just saying that noises at this volume are a part of life, and with safe exposure time they're typically not even mildly dangerous. I mean, this dryer might reach 90dB, but you don't spend more than 2 minutes in a bathroom listening to it typically, which is WELL within safe exposure ranges. As long as you don't plan on spending 2 hours in the bathroom with your ear pressed up against the dryer, you should be fine. Because I have this knowledge, I've been able to free myself of my anxiety around loud noises - even though they still cause me some discomfort. This discomfort is normal.

      I don't get spikes unless the noise I was exposed to is louder than 95 dB though, slamming doors make my ears ring louder for a few seconds, but then it always calms down. Personally, I hate high-pitched loud noises the most. I have bad T, but my hearing is still spectacular. The high pitched whine that old TVs make PISSES ME OFF SO BADLY. GOD it's annoying.
       
    23. Telis

      Telis Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Calgary
      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      Funny you have spectacular hearing with bad T, how hell does that work? You can hear a pin drop through your loud T? Yeah your T isn't that loud then. From 7khz up I hear nothing but T, no exterior noise will go through it. If you can hear faint noises through or around your T, its not loud at all, it's very mild and should be easily maskable with that kind of hearing.
       
    24. quietatnight
      Frustrated

      quietatnight Member

      Location:
      Rockford IL
      Tinnitus Since:
      1990
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Accustic tramma due being too close to a fire craker when I was a kid
      Vaba

      Oh you have been totally clear about how you feel that short exposure of loud sounds won't damage your hearing. I just took a look at your profile and noticed that you are pretty new to TT only a few months, looking at your picture you seem to be kind of young also, maybe in your early 20's. I would have to assume that you have not had enough time to have done much damage to your ears. Just a note,,, I am 63 and have had tinnitus since I was in my 20's so I have had a lot more time and experience with it. Not that it really matters I understand that anyone can have tinnitus. I would have to say it's fair to say that I have had much more exposure to loud sounds the you. I used to think just like you, and lived my life not worrying about loud sounds and tell myself all the time "oh, that concert was only for a few hours, I can handle that" or "that running my power saw was only for a couple of hours, no problem". But sounds like that are accusative over time. My tinnitus all started with 1 fire cracker, a tiny black cat to be exact that someone set off right next to my left ear my early 20's, that's all that it took. I lost all hearing in that ear for around 30 days. Oh my hearing finally did return but with tinnitus and I have had it ever since. Over the years I had many more acoustic traumas, each time I would recover but it started to take a little more longer each time and left me with a little louder tinnitus. I have had to be more careful over the years and found myself having to wear hearing protection a lot more offten.

      Fast forward to now:

      Just this past month I have had two more acoustic episodes, from as you say "Normal unavoidable sounds". One was about a month ago when I just happened to be standing in a friends home right under his door bell chime, when it rang, I got an instant spike that took me 2 weeks to recover from that and for the first time I never made it back to my baseline. Then a week later and this was my last acoustic trauma. Their was someone down the street from me that is building a new home using a bull dossier that just happened to start to back up as I was walking up my driveway towards the mailbox, and it's back up alarm went off. I did not have my ear plugs in so I right away ran back into the house only about 20 feet to my front door. I was exposed to that Beep Beep Beep sound for only about 5 seconds. BUT when I got back in my home and closed the door I already had a loud spike. I could not believe it, but it happened. I have been hearing those backup alarms all of my life until I moved up here to the country to get away from them a couple of years ago so it's been awhile and they never caused me harm before. Not to mention it was about 800 feet from me. None of that mattered, now it's been 11 days today and I still have this spike. In the old days my spikes would have been long gone in 3 days, but here I am hearing the raise in my tinnitus as I write this right now.

      You get my point, if you would have asked me if this was possible a few year's ago I would have said "no way" I think as we age, and our ears and tinnitus get's worse, we are a lot more likely to get hearing damage from a lot less DB of sounds even from "Normal every day" sounds that we have lived with our entire lives.



      Louie


      Quietatnight


      PS: Sorry about the font;s at the end I have no idea what that happened.
       
    25. Vaba
      Shitfaced

      Vaba Member

      Location:
      New New York
      Tinnitus Since:
      Unknown
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown. Gradual, Progressive
      It's weird, I know, and I can't even explain my hearing in a way that even makes sense. It confuses me every single day. I also want to say that I can hear a pin drop - but only if I REALLY listen for it. I have to dig through the sound in my ears - it takes a lot of brain power and I'm often very tired. My audiograms are also unusual - I have a weird, "pitted" loss that fluctuates - like, I have a 0db threshold at 4k in my right ear, but then a 15dB loss at 6k in the same ear. Then I take the same test again, and it's 0-5dB all the way up to 16kHz... ABRs are great, tympanometry is normal, OAEs great. No indication of substantial damage.

      I'm not entirely sure yet that my T is from hearing loss. It's HIGHLY somatic, and I'm still finding out about it. Just today I decided to eat a liquid diet & sleep on my back like my maxillofacial surgeon recommended, and the T in my right ear has gone down 35% and the fluctuating whistle tone is 75% gone, while the unidentifiable/atonal hiss in my left has gone down 20%. My left ear feels like its burned inside. It hurts, and always draws my attention back to the tinnitus.

      I'm sure mine is "better" than yours (of course, tinnitus can't be "good" at all), and I very much hope I'm not seeming insensitive - I want to apologize and say that I'm in a different boat than you guys.I haven't yet had an issue with long-lasting spikes (@quietatnight) so I suppose me participating in this thread isn't helpful - I feel like I'm outclassed in information here - Like I'm a Geologist giving a presentation on plate movements to a bunch of neurosurgeons.

      My knowledge & experiences just don't apply in this situation, I suppose. I'm sorry if I seemed insensitive!
       
      • Like Like x 1
    26. linearb
      Psychedelic

      linearb Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      East Coast USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      1998
      @quietatnight one thing that concerns me in your post: you appear to have a progressive condition, and you've also been on benzos long term.

      Tinnitus can go different ways; someone I know from back home is in his 70s, and has had it for 40 years from a power sanding incident, and says it's never changed. Genetics and noise exposure are certainly factors, and the fact that your initial incident involved 30 days of profound hearing loss indicates that trauma was very severe. But, I've read enough about benzos to suspect that over a long period of time, they might well contribute to all kinds of neurological decline, including hearing loss or tinnitus. so, they are a double edged sword...
       
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