Went to a Birthday Party Tonight — Hoping for the Best!

Well, I guess the time had to come, when I would need to test my luck with noise: my sister-in-law's husband was celebrating his 60th bday tonight, with a 3-piece band at a country club. Wasn't a crazy party or anything - my decibel meter rarely if ever touched 90 - and I had my 25 dB EarPeace plugs in the whole night. So hopefully I'll be okay. But still, whenever the drum got going, I could still feel it percuss through the plugs. Or at least I felt like I could.

This is my first big test since developing the tinnitus. I'm now laying in bed, back from the party. My tinnitus is definitely a bit elevated, but not horrendous. Cheers to whatever the morning may bring...

 

If you are willing to take those risks, you aren't really bothered by your tinnitus.

 

Well I just mowed the lawn... I don't have much choice with a pregnant wife and a house inspection coming. But I wore ear defenders and ear plugs. I got some somatic ringing but no worse than a little trip in the car. Took plenty of NAC beforehand. I think it'll be ok.

 

What's a proper NAC dose?

I've mowed the lawn several times with double protection too, and haven't yet experienced any spikes from it. That said, I think I'm going to buy one of be quiet battery powered models - saw someone using one a few weeks ago, and it's super fantastic quiet.

 

While I don't think it very sympathetic, there's actually probably some truth to your statement Bill.

Not that I'm not bothered by my tinnitus; I certainly am. But it's also true that I have been coping pretty well so far, and am not yet at the point where I'm willing to let it completely rule my life. I may get there - in fact I may get there quickly if events like tonight's increase my pitch or volume. But I'm not there quite yet.

I'm well aware that tinnitus is going to lead to some lifestyle changes. Many, in fact. But many, many people with tinnitus live relatively normal lives, and I'd like to give myself the opportunity to be one of those people.

It's very possible that I have that intractable sort of tinnitus that will prevent me from partaking in normal social gatherings for the rest of my life. But it's equally likely - at this point anyway - that I do not. And what a shame it would be if I allowed myself to get so wrapped up in my fear over tinnitus that I gave all of that up unnecessarily?

Personally, I think attending an 85-90 dB event with ear protection is a fairly responsible way to test the waters, see what I really can and can't handle anymore. Some on here will disagree. And if I experience a permanent increase from this, I'll likely change my tune pretty quickly. But it's perfectly likely that this does nothing more than give me a two-day spike...and if that's the case, then I'd rather continue to live my life, today and into the future.

I'll update this thread over the next little bit, to keep everyone posted on how I recover from this. I track my tinnitus symptoms very carefully, so will be able to provide empirical data. If I end up significantly worse, that'll serve as fair warning for others. But equally true: if I end up experiencing nothing but a temporary spike, perhaps it help serve as an important contrast to the doom/gloom that normally fills these pages.

 

As a first post: it's now 6 am and I've had some trouble sleeping tonight because my symptoms have definitely spiked a bit. Not a crazy amount, but there's no denying that they're elevated.

Specifically, I generally hear tinnitus in both ears, as well as my head, and keep separate ratings of each one. In my own subjective rating scheme, I've been consistently rating my left ear a 2-3/10, my right ear a 1-2/10, and my head a 2-3/10. The head is the worst one for me, when it really gets going, it sort of squiggles through the front of my head, and can be very difficult to deal with.

Right now, I'd rate my symptoms as follows:

Left ear: 2.5/10
Right ear: 1/10
Head: 4/10 (no squiggle)

So I'm experiencing a mild spike, outside my normal rating range. But not crazily so. Granted, I'm still having trouble sleeping (in my rating system 4/10 is getting into "difficult" territory). But it's not outside the realm of myriad other spikes I've experienced over the course of the last 4 months.

Usually my spikes last between 1-3 days. I'll keep posting on my progress re this one.

 

I think it is possible to psych yourself into having spikes. If you dwell on it too much you will.

OP, You took the necessary precautions. The volume wasn't that high. Don't be convinced you'll have a spike. Its not like you went to a much louder event unprepared. Be convinced that you took the necessary precaution with your ear protection. You'll be fine.

Foam, I've had this loud tinnitus for over ten years. I mow my yard. I wear good plugs. I don't go out thinking what a bad idea this is. I go out looking forward to protected distraction from tinnitus.

 

Nobody knows precisely what is the correct balance of sound exposure with tinnitus. My Audiologist is in the sound exposure camp. Avoidance is as problematic as over exposure. Matt is a smart guy and took necessary precautions.

Some let tinnitus rule their life and others don't. Likely those that don't do the best.

Matt, whatever you do, never stop using headphones. I listen to mine everyday. One of life's joys.
The sound articulation with high end headphones is amazing.

Be well brother.

This young talent is what makes life worth living....

Emanne Beasha: 10 Year Old Opera Singer Leaves...

 

What is "somatic ringing"?

 

Thanks Tex - that is *mostly* how I feel. As it's my first "test", I'm a little nervous; but the math (90db with reasonable plugs) should come out in my favour. Appreciate your wisdom.

 

So are the two ENTs below:

Might this explain the results of the poll below?
https://www.tinnitustalk.com/thread...orum-more-useful-than-your-ents-advice.28006/
where 85% of respondents thought that the advice of their ENT was useless or made their T worse (with almost 18% saying that this advice made their T worse).

Not if you compare the costs and benefits. The benefit of exposure is fun for several hours. The cost is the potential torture and regret lasting a lifetime.

Earplugs provide a false sense of security All of the Time:

You can ignore reality, but you won't be able to ignore the consequences of ignoring reality. Ultimately, it is those whose tinnitus is the loudest, who have tinnitus rule their life. Avoidance increases the chance that one's tinnitus won't be loud, and THAT is the way to ensure that tinnitus doesn't rule one's life.

Are you saying that it wouldn't be a shame if you taking a foolish risk were to lead to you getting debilitating tinnitus, making your body uninhabitable? Basically throwing your life away?

If you begin hitting a wall with a hammer, it takes some time before you make a hole in the wall. You might end up being better off getting a permanent increase Now, than not getting this feedback, and continuing harming your health and ending up with a louder permanent increase in the future.

 

Bill,
Didn't know you were such a doomsday sayer. I listen to headphones everyday. Probably an hour or so already today. One of life's pleasures denied by too many that read the crap spewed by one guy on here like a broken record.

Let me ask you a basic question. Is your tinnitus worse than mine? And if you believe it is, how do you know?
Or...is mine actually worse than yours but my mental health allows me to live with my tinnitus more easily than you?

And further, why do you think your tinnitus is worse than mine if it is?
And lets say for discussion purposes, your tinnitus is worse than mine. With your suggested practices, how did it get worse than mine when I listen to headphones everyday? You don't suppose that the true underlying cause of contracting tinnitus and making it worse is something other than headphone usage which is just another sound source.

What do you base this on? Is it the same non scientific basis as believing headphones are injurious to those with NIT tinnitus? You can ignore reality too Bill.

 

For me, there is no such a thing as testing your Tinnitus. Every day, your body gets older. I bet, that with each new day, the phantom sounds inflammation inside your brain, is increased. Maybe some day are calmer than others, but usually the amount of inflammation just keeps growing. You don't even have to be exposed to absolutely any sounds during the day, for your Tinnitus to increase. That's just my opinion. Also, I have great respect for people who had Tinnitus for 20-30 years, and I can't get my head around how loud their phantom sounds can get.

 

Bill, you may ultimately be right. You really may. I cannot say you won't be.

In fact, with regard to avoidance being the only sure way to ensure safety, you are of course correct. If one does not leave their house, the likelihood of a plane falling on them is certainly decreased.

Also true, this person that doesn't leave their home for theses reasons will have become a reclusive hermit with an anxiety disorder. But the fact that a plane is unlikely to fall on them is undeniable.

 

Also @Bill Bauer:

You're absolutely right that someone who keeps repeating the same mistakes, keeps banging their head against the wall, keeps ignoring the signs, deserves what they get.

But in order to *repeat* a mistake, you have to first make it. In order to *ignore* a sign, you have to first receive it. Following up on my previous post: avoidance *prior to receiving* the sign is, in my opinion, a symptom of an anxiety problem. And if that avoidance effects one's behaviors in a demonstrable way, it would become a symptom of an anxiety disorder.

Those are correlated with tinnitus unsurprisingly. And equally not fun.

So I'm going to test the waters. If I receive information indicating that something will is making my tinnitus worse, I won't ignore (even if that thing is headphones - sorry John). But until then, I'm going to avoid doubling the number of disabilities I have by adding anxiety disorder to the list.

 

For those interested, it's now 2pm, and my tinnitus remains predictably tweaked. The pitch, the volume, and the sensitivity are all up one notch. No new sounds, no spike higher than anything I've experienced before. But noticeable tweaked nonetheless.

As I said, my spikes tend to last 1-3 days (median 2), and sometimes get worse into day 2 before subsiding. Won't be surprised if this one follows that course.

 

@Pawel1

With respect, I don't think there is any evidence, and little logic, that supports your perspective. That doesn't mean you're wrong, and I'm not trying to suggest you alter your perspective - if that's the perspective that helps you cope, then that's the perspective you should hold.

But just to put your views *in perspective*:

* While the onset of tinnitus shows a clear age-related effect, I am aware of no evidence that indicates an age-related worsening of existing tinnitus. I don't even think it matches polls taken on this board, where the most severe sufferers congregate. (Anyone: am I wrong about this?)

* The idea that inflammation continues to grow every day is out of line with what is known about inflammation-mechanics and the immune system. Tinnitus is not cancer - it doesn't multiply or metastasize. It is - ostensibly - about inflammation, which may increase, decrease or stay the same, in any given individual.

* Most of all: even if points 1 and 2 were true, that would have no bearing on whether tinnitus was measurable/testable or not. Would you argue the same thing of Alzheimer's or Parkinson's or any other disorder that clearly does show age-related decline, or a consistent worsening if untreated (cancer?). Of course not: rather, one must take into account the age-related pattern when undertaking their tests. There are many well-established ways to do this.

Not trying to pick on you; again, you should hold the perspective that works best for you. But I fear that the perspective that 'the course of tinnitus is so inevitable that there is no point in testing it' could be quite detrimental if held by the broader community (public, scientific, political) to hold. So I wanted to speak out on this.

 

When my Audiologist who picked up on my education and background got in the weeds with me about tinnitus, when I started asking her in depth questions... she told me what she thought. We basically see it the same. She said the no. 1 reason for hearing loss and tinnitus is hereditary. Yes, it can be accelerated by noise exposure or toxicity or sickness. But the laughable myth about NIT on this forum is when it comes to headphone use in particular is....virtually all hearing loss and tinnitus is NIT related. A matter of degree.

If a 20 lb object falls on a 300 lb man versus a 5 lb baby, chances of survivability of the man versus the baby is much greater. Same with hearing. A person with fragile hearing genetically given the same sound exposure will suffer greater hearing loss and probability of contracting tinnitus. It is why so many more old people have tinnitus than young people. Their immune and nervous system breaks down causing failure of the hearing apparatus.
Hereditary.

 

All I'm saying, is that an average Tinnitus sufferer, goes through a certain amount of stress/anxiety each day, along with certain noise exposure (Let's assume that we can set average values.) Therefore, if you multiply an average day by 365 or by 1000, then you are likely to be getting less healthy with each year, assuming that you continue living the same lifestyle over the course of that period of 1 year. I definitely felt younger, just 1 year ago, but I am aware that each person has a different body, therefore there are different circumstances. Let's say, that I am sharing my experience, not scientific knowledge. But, dying cells inside your body, is a rather scientific fact. I know that I sound extremely pessimistic, but this is just my opinion about Tinnitus. Unfortunately, in my case, Tinnitus never seems to be decreasing over the course of any days or months. It either stays the same, or worsens. Therefore, it simply worsens, because I am a person that goes to work in a crowded area, I watch TV, I talk to people, etc, etc. Also, it looks to me like you're trying to imply, that Tinnitus is not a big problem for fresh sufferers or for young people. But, please, do not drag this conversation much further, as it's not very pleasant for me.

 

And Matt, if you really drill down on your spike because its pretty clear you have had them before like many of us here do, it 'maybe completely unrelated to you attending the birthday party'....have nothing to do with it. Just like most can't figure out why their tinnitus spikes...can be completely unrelated to added sound exposure. Sometimes my tinnitus goes down when subjected to greater sound level.

 

Mine hasn't changed much in three years I have had it since its onset. Cell degradation which is undeniable doesn't necessary correlate to tinnitus loudness. Opposite maybe true. Synchronized neurons in the brain stem may lose some level of ferocity and organization due to neurons dying, not gain intensity.
Sorry about your theory. Unsupported here.

 

It's not hard to keep roughly the same volume of Tinnitus for a few years. I'm assuming your current spikes of Tinnitus, are worse than the ones that you had 3 years ago. Is it not right? Unless you've had no spikes 3 years ago.

 

Mine is probably better than yours, partially because of my "risk-averse" approach.

Who said that you live with it more easily than me?!

Who said that one can't leave their house?! Trust me, there are Plenty of places out there, besides your home and venues with live music playing.

It is possible to do something that causes harm, not get any feedback such as pain, and continue doing it.

 

I would have attended the event you describe, although I think I would have used foam earplugs. I think the musician ones are not strong enough for those with noise induced tinnitus.

I don't believe we need to avoid all noise forevermore. On the one hand, I would not use headphones again as they are simply not necessary for me. However, I still mow the lawn, including the weed whacker and blower all gas powered with both my earplugs and ear muffs, and have not spiked or had any noticeable increase with my tinnitus after. Each has to choose what they are comfortable with

 

With respect, I don't buy this.

(Not that I don't buy that your tinnitus sometimes fluctuates randomly, or goes down after a noise exposure. I buy that, of course, if you tell me it's the case. But I don't buy that this means that one can't figure out their triggers, or track/predict their tinnitus, with some degree of precision).

First, that's a bit of a dangerous way of thinking, because it really could lead one to ignore information telling them that something is bad for them. If I experience spikes after a given noise exposure, I owe it to myself to take that pretty seriously.

But also, same as my response to Pawel about the untestability of tinnitus because of progressive changes, I must take issue with the potential untestability of tinnitus because of random changes.

Do random events occur? Sure. Do they add variability to the data? Of course. Ironically, what they call that in the scientific domain is 'noise'. Indeed, what we're talking about here is a signal-to-noise issue, where the goal is to identify the signal in a series of 'noisy' data points that include some randomness in their fluctuation. There are lots of ways to do this; it is far from impossible.

Might this particular spike be due to something else? Yeah, I suppose. Unlikely, but you're right - it could be. But the chances that random spikes continue to follow noise exposure in my life would seem unlikely. And so, over the course of time, with more of these "test", I'll be able to get a pretty good idea of my reaction to this type of noise exposure.

 

Why would you assume this?

 

Again, there is no denying this @Bill Bauer. The world is a dangerous place.

However, this way of thinking can go on ad infinitum, and *is* the way anxiety and personality disorders develop.

People have to make choices regarding how risk averse they want to be and how much of life they want to give up to avoid situations that "have the potential" to cause harm. Some people won't fly in planes because it may crash, some people won't ride elevators because it may fall, some people won't leave their house because they fear open spaces. And you won't approach sound, because it *may* make you worse. As you strongly implied, you are not looking for evidence that it will make you worse - the mere possibility scares you enough to keep you away.

I'm not saying this is wrong for you. Rather, I'm asking you to stop telling others what is wrong for them.

 

Thanks Doc - I had foamies with me as well, and almost put them in. In the end, I opted for the highest level EarPeace filters that I had (25db), because it's just so hard to hear anyone with the foamies in, and there's not really full point in attending these events if I can't be even a bit social. But I take your point, and agree that foam would offer more protection.

I have another event in a month - my daughter's bat mitzvah. Honestly, I don't know what I'm going to do about that, because it's going to be louder than this. Foamies are almost a given; but it may just be that I can't even stay in the room when the music is going (2/3rds of the night). That will be really disappointing, but I worry that that one really will be too loud. We'll see!

 

And precisely why what your write should be discredited. You have no idea what you are talking about.
Your 'risk-averse' approach maybe contributing to your tinnitus based upon sound avoidance. Nobody knows the best balance for each of us based upon genetics and/or damage.
You have no idea if the sound in your head is louder or softer than in my head or if you handle it better or worse.

 

You may need the ear muffs too for that event. As it is your event, you should also request the music volume to not be so loud.