Treatment Prospects: Vagus Nerve Stimulation

Discussion in 'Research News' started by Markku, Mar 8, 2011.

    1. Codaz

      Codaz Member

      Sjoerd, maybe you can sent me some info in Dutch via PM, thx.
       
    2. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013
      ok...why is this topic so inactive?Why is this topic so inactive? To me this treatment is far more promesing than any drug currently developed....
       
    3. lapidus

      lapidus Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
      It is inactive because they have been very quiet about it for a while. We have no new info to discuss. And I don't want to be a downer but this treatment wont be available for everybody. It's invasive and therefore expensive. I think only very severe cases will be able to get this treatment. At least in the beginning, if it works.
       
    4. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013
      Agreed, but in the short term this does give us a better outlook. one might not need to suffer endlessly. It is surgery , so it is invasive, but it is not like they have to cut you open from top to bottom. The vagus nerve is very easily accessible in the neck. They talk about a 45 minute procedure. Loads of poeple of corrective type surgery that is far more invasive and they can pay for it out of there own pocket.

      besides....this therapy is a one time deal. What do drugs cost? 500 to a 1000 dollars per year?
       
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    5. lapidus

      lapidus Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
      Yeah, that's true.
       
    6. Matthias

      Matthias Member

      Location:
      Belgium
      Tinnitus Since:
      07/2006
      I wouldn't get too excited yet.
      They told me in Antwerp they have tested it themselves, and it didn't work, sadly :(
       
    7. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013
      I am only aware of this small scale study.

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24255953
       
    8. lapidus

      lapidus Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
      You need to be more specific. Who are "they"? Do you mean the people behind this? Cause they are in Dallas, not Anwerp. And yes, of course they have tested it, the link that Sjored provided is from the small study they did on 10 patients. That info has been out there for quite some time. The results of that small study can be both positive and negative depending on how you look at things. To me that study is quite optimistic.
       
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    9. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013
      5 patients had a good results and 5 had no results. Funny thing is that all the patients that had no results where on either a benzodiazepine or SSRi drug.
       
    10. lapidus

      lapidus Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
    11. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013

      I am not sure if this is sarcasm with the quotes and all, difficult to read sarcasm in written text...:)

      Anyway: For those that responded to the therapy the improvement was drastic. Your article states a 26 dB average reduction in measured loudness.
       
    12. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013
      @lapidus : This study was executed in Antwerp, belgium.

      Also, something that I find stunning....the treatment is only 2.5 hours per day for only 20 day's.
       
    13. lapidus

      lapidus Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
      @Sjoerd
      Haha, no I wasnt being sarcastic, I actually think that those results were positive :)
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    14. Codaz

      Codaz Member

      @Sjoerd

      Great, but this nerve stimulation does not solve the jaw clenching / grinding / muscular tension which somatosensory tinnitus patients have. You still need therapy /drugs / time for that.
       
    15. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013
      as far as I know somatosensory tinnitus is extremely common. As far as I understand this therapy can help even if you have somatosensory tinnitus. It will train your brain to listen to sounds instead of other internal signals. The internal competition in the brain will (or atleast it should) cause the neurons to learn the pattern that is a result of the stimules that is combined with the nerve stimulation.

      As far as jaw clenching and stuff like that (I tend to clench my jaws allot) forms of Yoga or Tai Chi can relieve symptoms. If you have any type of muscle tension you need to calm your mind and a good way to do that is to practice any kind of moving meditation. The worst thing you can do is sit on a couch and tell yourself to calm down.
       
      • Helpful Helpful x 1
    16. Codaz

      Codaz Member

      Yeah, I did an intro course of mindfulness last week. Will try Yoga introduction in some time.

      The worst thing psychologists do when you have not calmed down is prescribe you Lorazepam or something. It's like they get sponsored from the pharmaceutical companies to prescribe us this stuff. I sincerely hope that my non frequent intake of Lorazepam not screwed up my brain in a way that is was vulnerable to T.
       
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    17. Matthias

      Matthias Member

      Location:
      Belgium
      Tinnitus Since:
      07/2006
      I just want to be carefull, to respect researchers privacy. It might have been "off-record" information, i don't know.
      It was in the Brai2n-clinic. They are connected to other facilities and dr's (like in Dallas), so they probably received a serenade device to test or received the treatment protocol to implement themselves.
      The VNS did work for depression but not on the T-loudness
       
    18. Matthias

      Matthias Member

      Location:
      Belgium
      Tinnitus Since:
      07/2006
      I meant Serenity instead of Serenade. Isn't it possible to edit posts?
       
    19. HighDesertSage

      HighDesertSage Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      05/2013
    20. Blueberry

      Blueberry Member

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      05/2014
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma
      Hi !
      I've just discovered this topic… I did not all understand actually… (yes I'm french :) ) Could VNS be a treatment for non tonal tinnitus too ?
       
    21. Sjoerd

      Sjoerd Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09-2013
      I would think so. With this treatment they try to restore normal auditory map distribution. With tinnitus they think that allot of neurons have poor tuning. In other words, neurons tend to fire upon a wide range of inputs instead of just a certain tone (they are just doing something). With the vagus nerve stimulation they have a tool to tell the neurons that their current activity is very important (and thus they should learn/change). They combine pure tones with vagus nerve stimulation because it is easier (try to tune a piano while the band is playing, not so easy).

      You might ask, why does vagus nerve stimulation promote brain changes....well the exact mechanism seems to be unknown but it is linked to release of certain neurotransmitters. They have been using this therapy, to drive plastic changes in the brain, for years. For tinnitus just the last couple of years. For animals they where able to completely reverse the pathology of tinnitus (in other words, there was no behavior evidence that those animals where perceiving tinnitus). Auditory cortex mapping show normal activity/mapping (no evidence of tinnitus).

      Lets say that a given neuron fires upon any sound between 15kHz and 19Khz, after therapy it will only fire upon between sounds of 16.5 kHz and 17.5 kHz (improved tuning)

      Intresting lecture from dr. Kilgard:
      https://archive.org/details/Redwood_Center_2011_09_21_Michael_Kilgard
       
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    22. skoupidis

      skoupidis Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2014
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma or mvc
      It is interesting although vague to how it will work (if it works) on humans. Animal testing has even gone to the state of restoring hearing, something that should take precedence but still...
      For me it remains a questionable approach. Fine-tuning the human brain? Hard to buy...
       
    23. lapidus

      lapidus Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
      They have already done a study on humans, it's covered quite well in this thread.
       
    24. skoupidis

      skoupidis Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2014
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma or mvc
      Indeed, with mixed results. And only one study! Not much to go on IMO. I do find it really primitive in ways of curing something as complicated as Tinnitus with mere electric current. For all we know that damn thing could cause more neuro- damage... Who is to guarantee it will not? Not to mention that electrode fusion...
      Therapies like this should be considered EXTREMELY experimental and with ambiguous/dangerous results.
      I think that if it where to provide positive results we would know by now, don't you?
       
    25. lapidus

      lapidus Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
      I don't know really. They are supposedly planning or conducting another study right now but it's been very quiet so I guess we won't know anything until they have gathered all the data and published it. But still, from my understanding it had great success on the 4 people it worked on. That's always something I guess.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    26. Viking
      No Mood

      Viking Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Italia
      I ask for this treatment to Dr. Vanneste, De Ridder, Rosellini. ..all the same answer: you haven't requirements: pure tone tinnitus, unilateral, not reactive,not taking meds at least 3 month :mad::cry:
       
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    27. James White
      Anime

      James White Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Toulouse, France
      Tinnitus Since:
      April 2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Maybe loud music. Not sure.
      Hi,

      i've been reading a few studies on VNS and epilepsy. This is not related to tinnitus, but this VNS therapy seems to work quite well for this population.

      http://www.seizure-journal.com/article/S1059-1311(13)00130-1/abstract

      http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12808412
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    28. Mr lui

      Mr lui Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2014.11.23
      Hi,everyone,greetings
      I'm new here,i have a question that if anyone here can help me with.
      i have high frecrency hearing loss in my left ear up to 70 dcb in which i can hardly hear birds sing or any sound from insect,in such case can these therapys like VNS may take any effect cause i understand they play a series of
      tonel sound into your both ears?
      However,my right ear is still funcional.
      much appreciated
      PS,it's bad that i can't even use white noise to mask my tinnitus in my injuered ear
       
    29. Dubbyaman
      Angry

      Dubbyaman Member Advocate

      Location:
      Northern Indiana
      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2014
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Excessive loud noise
      Anyone know any verdicts or updates on VNS therapy paired with tones?
       
    30. Sound Wave
      Curious

      Sound Wave Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Finland
      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Probably headphones
      • Informative Informative x 1

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