A constant loop - headaches, dizziness, depression and tinnitus

So I attended the Michael Jackson Cirque du Soleil show last night (good show btw) and was so happy I remembered to bring some ear plugs with me. The music/drumming/singing was super loud even with my 33db plugs in. My T was raging last night after I got home and is still going strong today...and my ears even are a little painful at times. I'm hoping this returns to a lower level in a few days...unfortunately my lower level is very loud begin with. It saddens me that even with ear protection I can't attend events like this without paying the price and making my T worse. It's been 8 months and it still is a daily struggle trying to habituate. I suffer from anxiety and depression and my chronic headaches (possibly antidepressant related) seems to exacerbate my T...it makes me often wonder if my T causes my headaches and depression or vise versa. I feel there is a direct correlation between my headaches, dizziness, depression and loudness of my T...I'm always searching for that missing piece of this complicated puzzle but I feel I keep going in circles.

 

Hi @Lynnette, your T sounds terrible. Habituation is tricky: some people manage it in a few weeks; for others it takes longer. Keep going. It will happen.

Can I ask, have you been to a doctor about your headaches and have they done an MRI? Perhaps it is something to do with your medication? The headaches and dizziness are not a good thing, especially after this length of time. Perhaps you should check out the Doctor's Corner and ask Dr. Nayler for advice?

 

Hi Lynnette.

I guess that T, dizziness, depression and anxiety is related to each other.
It is the same for me. I have no headaches, but because of T I have developed anxiety and depression.
I do not really have dizziness, but sometimes I feel dizzy when I think too much about my suffering and how things will look like in the future.

I try living life as normal as possible and hope for habituation. So I hope this will happen for us.
Interestingly if I go to loud events (circus, concert; without ear plugs), my T goes down.
Maybe it is because I am distracted so much or other parts of my auditory context are addressed. I don't know.

So regarding dizziness, you can ask for a doctor to make appropriate tests. But I think it is because of anxiety and depression.

All the best,
Martin

 

Benign Paroxysmal Positional Vertigo?

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/benign-paroxysmal-positional-vertigo-and-tinnitus.4036/

 

did you insert your ear plugs correctly? a surprising number of people don't do it right.

 

even with damaged hair cells, it is not enough to show up on audiogram as "abnormal" - even 20db of loss is still called "normal". you definitely damaged ur hair cells, just do not go to those kinds of things any more, this is a health issue. if this was a work place, it would be MANDATORY to have DOUBLE protection: over the ear, PLUS in the ear protectors. because it is not industrial workplace, u learn lesson the hard way.

 

My only comment is what I have already stated numerous other times in various posts: stay away from loud noise (with or without ear protection). Here's a post of mine only one day old:

https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/target-shooting-and-tinnitus.4199/#post-40667

Unfortunately, there are members on this board who keep saying "you'll be fine with earplugs". When tinnitus is present, it usually means there is some kind of damage to the inner ear. In such cases, further damage is likely to occur more easily than in people with normal hearing. Therefore: stay away from loud noise.

 

What I'm curious about, and I've just been learning about tinnitus in the last week, is why does for a certain tinnitus case of a certain level and character of sound and whatnot, why does it get louder after exposure to loud noise, like a rock concert, and then return to it's previous level in time? Why does it go up, and then back down? Or does it? And how is it that people who aren't suffering from it, but get some ringing after a show that lasts only a few days, and then it disappears?

I'm sorry if that's a stupid question, but why does it go up and down? What's the thinking on that? Because I thought it was permanent and was never supposed to go away, which is true, and yet it can get worse and then get better. And it does go away in the case of people of who get it after a show and then it does indeed go away in a few days.

And I would agree to simply avoid loud noise at all cost. One can still enjoy life without rock concerts. It's probably not worth it.

 

I've had numerous tests, including MRI's and VNG's with no findings. I believe my headaches are related to medication and depression but I've moved onto antidepressant #2 with no change in headaches. The headaches make me more depressed (not just because they are painful, my mood actually slips into a depressive state). Then my T appears that much louder since I'm focused inward again. Can't win in this cycle until my headaches stop.

 

Yeah I didn't think a show like that would be so loud though...my mistake. I have no plans to attend concerts and do try to avoid loud places since my T onset. It is a mystery to me as well why T can spike for a few days and then return to your base level....or does on base level just shift and we eventually get used to a louder sound? The friend I went with got in her car at the end of the show and said "wow, my ears are ringing"... and that was it...it disappeared the next morning. Who knows why ours never disappears....I sure would like to know!

 

Lynnette...
I have to strongly agree with attheedgeofscience, that once one has had a bout of tinnitus that does not just go away like with 'normal'? people ("wow my ears are ringing" + laughter...then it goes away), then it is maybe a lifetime thing to be careful of, and avoid the insanely loud levels that are somehow legal at concerts, movies, "Cirque", theaters, etc. Let alone shooting ranges and stuff.

Sound seems to come in through the bones in the back of the head too as even with full earplugs and aircraft carrier grade military earmuffs, I would still get affected by plain road noise on a freeway...Ummm, maybe not a German autobahn as they are so smooth, but here in USA. The sound was hardly coming through my ears, but it sure got through somehow and made my tinnitus louder. It was hard for me to even believe. And it was not just "internal loop volume subjectivity" either.

However, the good news is, that even at that level of sensitivity and volume, I became pretty much "unaware" of my tinnitus over a period of four to five years. By six years I was able to tolerate pretty loud sound that I would not have thought anywhere near possible again. The key was to not expose for too long, and/or protect....And at a long event like "Cirque" concert I'm afraid that pushes the envelope too far for just plugs...even good ones.

It is often easy to forget "exposure time" and concentrate on "volume" of noise. That's what tripped me up even with all my years of tinnitus experience (and hyperacusis) where I should have known better. I was, and am, great at pre-predicting loud sounds just before they happen and mostly catch them with fingers in my ears, or the plugs are in, but that exposure time one is more tricky. With my recent jump up on 2012, the volume seemed not too bad (and way, way less than what you were at re Cirque) but it was a meeting that lasted many hours. I was totally unaware of it at the time until it was too late. I walked out of there with even louder ringing than my loud base rate (s0 yes, it can go up -permanently). I figured it would go down again to my usual loud baseline with a good night's sleep....It did not. I remained at a staggering loud level and has been the hardest for me to adapt to so far. Not there yet.

So...You are younger. Body heals faster. Probably more adaptable. You have 'only' had tinnitus for a short period of time (yeah I know that may sound insensitive), but really, it is highly, highly likely that in a few years from now you will be mostly unaware of it, and living a normal life. The statistics for that are just plain hard to deny, and I have "adapted" fully three times in my life even though obviously have a 'genetic'??? susceptibility to it. [Father, brother, me.]

However, that caveat...I would avoid things like Cirque for years. You will know when you are ready for something like that and will maybe even be OK with averagely decent plugs...Or the world will have woken up and sitting in auditoriums paying big money to get blasted with 115 decibels will become illegal. I'm not counting on that though, so it's up to you.

Hang in there, and TIME...is the great healer on this one. More than anything else I have tried, and I have tried a lot for it over the last 34 years. Depression, anxiety, etc, are also sort of par for the course in the rough patches. As the tinnitus improves the load is less and the whole basket gets lighter to carry.

Take gentle care, and good that the MRI's etc. are clean...means "time" can works it's subtle transition more freely.

Best, Zimichael.

 

Thanks for your words of wisdom Zimichael...interesting point on how it's easy to forget exposure time possibly at a lower level of volume and focus only on the volume of noise at a higher level. What is a safe level for people like us?

 

Lynnette..... Gee whiz, I wish I what a safe sound level was knew! It is obviously very individual, as look what has happened to me with these successive 'jumps up". I don't think that is a norm at all, but I have no data on how many tinnitus folks get 'permanent' louder tinnitus from a 'new' sound exposure incident. It would be useful to know actually.

"Spikes" for sure happen, as they are well reported on this board, though by inference they imply that they are just that..."spikes". In other words they go back down to base level. When/if the tinnitus spike does not go down, then you have a new 'higher base level'. That is not so much fun and I would not encourage it at all.

If it will happen to you by exposure to loud sound, even with protection (like at Cirque), I don't know but I sure would not take the risk. To me the "standard decibel levels" for the start of hearing damage do not seem to apply. My exposure decibel levels in Dec. 2012 were not up in that range, or if so, very briefly. However, my exposure time was about 3 to 4 hours.....I thought I was OK because was paying attention to 'volume' and if things got a bit loud I just stuck my fingers in my ears. I felt no need for plugs.... Unfortunately that was a big error on my part.

So....Ummmmmmmmm. I guess you have to decide for yourself. Risk v. reward and all that, but indeed DO remember that "exposure time" factor. Very easy to forget...Oh and if you are taking any "hearing signature" meds (even Ibuprofen, etc.) be even more careful.

Hope this helps a little...and very best to you.

Zimichael