Massive Improvement in Tinnitus Using Dr. Wilden's Low-Level Laser Therapy (LLLT)

Discussion in 'Success Stories' started by Yvonne09, Nov 20, 2016.

    1. TimeWorks

      TimeWorks Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2006
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      not knows
      Just to be clear...I said "gone" I mean habituated...which is sort of "gone". Don't spend any money on anything.
       
    2. Paul10

      Paul10 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Stress
      Your username is very true. Unfortunately I'm almost 6 months in and still have changing T. I guess that's not uncommon; habituation is an individual process.
       
    3. Bobby B
      Fine

      Bobby B Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      long term NIHL and recent acoustic trauma
      I am doing lllt for noise trauma and associated hearing loss/H and I definitely got improvements BUT it's not a cure for T unless perhaps the damage is very mild and treatment is started asap after trauma

      More importantly it has to be done right - enough power and in the right wavelength

      And it's not about money - in fact LLt is about the cheapest "treatment" you can get

      All you need is a 20w led in 850 nm off eBay those cost under 50 usd and a power source, heat sink and that's it you get a high power LT device for under 100 dollars which is equivalent to the medical grade 20w laser Wilden uses at his office and far more effective than the 80mw "home laser" which cost a lot more - like 20 or 30 times that

      Even simple extra vitamins will cost more over time
       
    4. Vasili

      Vasili Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      December /016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced (most likely)
      Hi Bobby,
      I am also considering LT but am hesitant to pay 2k for a therapy that is yet of dubious results.
      Can i ask how you apply the LED therapy? Do you just place the LED light bulb next to your ear at the full 18W power?
      Have you had any side effect or improvement from this therapy?
       
    5. Bobby B
      Fine

      Bobby B Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      long term NIHL and recent acoustic trauma
      yes you place the light source near the ear and wear those airplane eyemask just in case to protect the eyes - 10 min every fews days over 3-4 years
       
    6. Vasili

      Vasili Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      December /016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced (most likely)
      • Like Like x 1
    7. Bobby B
      Fine

      Bobby B Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      long term NIHL and recent acoustic trauma
    8. Kaivey

      Kaivey Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      1987
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      rock concerts and discos
      I'm new here. I bought a 5w 850nm torch and I don't find it gets too hot using on my ears so I'm tempted to leave there for longer and not use it for a minute on and off. My trauma happened less than a week ago. How long do you think I should use this torch for.?

      I'm going to buy a 20w 850nm LED right away. How long should I use that on my ears for?

      I don't think I got much damage as I wasn't listening too music too loud, I was just sampling some gongs for my music project and it was a tiny bit loud but not uncomfortable but I was doing it for up to an hour. I did a hearing test online and my hearing is good for my age. I can hear over 15kz in my lefty ear and up to 13.5 kz in my right ear. When I was tested at work a few years I was told that my hearing was very good.

      I tried using the general fuzz online ACRN but my tinnitus is at the 13khz range. I have to turn the volume right up on my headphone amp to hear it and I realised that I might be harming my hearimg rather than helping it. If I was young I would be able to hear much higher up the frequency range and at 13kz with my amp right up I might find this range ear splitting. So although 13kz sonnds ultra quite and quite pleasant to me with my amp on at full it could still be damaging my ears. so I decided not to use the ACRN.
       
    9. Kaivey

      Kaivey Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      1987
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      rock concerts and discos
      Perhaps buying a 10w 850nm torch and using it for longer is simpler.
       
    10. Kaivey

      Kaivey Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      1987
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      rock concerts and discos
      I've had tinnitus for over thirty years. When I first got it I had horrible hyperacousis and some people's voices were painful to listen to. I would also get a feeling of fullness in my ears from time to time and this would really worry me. As the years went by my tinnitus faded and I got entirely used to it. The brain simplt learns to ignore it after and the brain must turn it off a bit and it perceives it not to be a danger.

      A few months back I started making music on my PC and stupidly I used the hesdphones a lot. I didn't have it very loud but I did think I was using the headphones too loud. Then last after listening to some gong samples on hedphones my tinnitus flaired up. I was so upset to have done such a stupid thing.

      I didn't have my headphones loud but I obviously have a vulnerability do to past damage but I did start to wonder if the drugs I'm on had caused it, so I googled pregabalin and some people say it has damaged their hearing. But I was on pregabalin over two years ago for over 12 months without problems. People who report hearing loss with pregabalin could really be getting problems for other reasons. There are millions of people on the net and you only have to have 20 people to blame their tinnitus on a drug for it to worry you. A doctor has a site and he says pregabalin causes hearing loss and tinnitus, but he could be a quack. |He lists almost every drug as a cause of hearing damage. Still, this could be a subject for another topic.
       
    11. Kaivey

      Kaivey Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      1987
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      rock concerts and discos
      Timeworks is right. People who experience improvement with 850nm torches may just be getting habituated. The 850nm LED devices give hope and this helps a person calm down. Once you have become habituated to tinnitus you hardly notice it anymore and then the brain slowly tones the tinnitus down.

      The brain ignores background noise but if you lose some hearing somewhere in the frequency range it amplifies that part of the hearing in an attempt to try to hear those missing frequencies so it can detect danger. But if you get used to the tinnitus then over time the the brain will calm the tinnitus down perceiving that that there is no danger because you have began to accept tinnitus. It may take up to 6 months to become habituate, and then up to two years for the tinnitus to fade.

      I'm interested in the 850nm technology to improve hearing but I know I will be able to get used to tinnitus again anyway.

      Julian Cowan Hill is amazing and he has really helped me to really calm down. I thought I was going to have to get habituated to tinnitus at a louder level now and I wasn't happy about it. But Julian strongly stresses how the brain turns down tinnitus as the years go by and this really calmed me down. He even has a video about Stopping bashing yourself about how you gave yourself tinnitus. I was so upset about how I caused my tinnitus to flair up again and he really helped.

      Julian had really bad tinnitus and he had become habituated to it and it had calmed right down, then one day he was at an event and he was walking by a speaker which suddenly burst out loud music deafening him in the left ear and causing raging tinnitus. But he managed to slowly habituate and then switch the tinnitus right down to a harmless level. Now he is comfortable and happy again and his tinnitus has faded.

      Julain even has a good video about people upsetting themselves after watching videos on YouTube where doctors and people might be saying that tinnitus is incurable, or people who say they are suicidal because of tinnitus. So if people say tinnitus never gets better, just ignore them, I know it does once you get used to it.


      Doubt & Despair with Tinnitus, by Julian Cowan Hill

      Doubt and despair are major blocks to getting better with tinnitus. A part of us refuses to accept that there is a way forward and will sabotage any attempt to let go and release symptoms. There is only one path. That is to move towards your suffering and make friends with it, unpack it, digest it, process it and let go. The more you let go of your resistance and work through your stuff, the more your tinnitus will back off. This symptom is dependent on resistance, impatience, struggle, stress, fear, anxiety etc to keep going. A solid body-based practice will cut through this resistance more and more.

      Doubt & Despair with Tinnitus


       
      • Funny Funny x 1
    12. Kaivey

      Kaivey Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      1987
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      rock concerts and discos
      Bobby B, what sort of heat sink will do? Some didn't look suitable on eBay and others were really expensive. How long do you use the 20 watt 850nm LED for, and how often per week. And how long should I use my 5 watt 850nm torch for until my 20w LED arrives.

      Here's an interesting study on LLLT.

      http://www.laser.nu/lllt/pdf/Tinnihelp3.pdf
       
    13. Kaivey

      Kaivey Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      1987
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      rock concerts and discos
      Kevin Barry cured his tinnitus which had had for ten years by doing Chi Kung (often spelt as quigong). According to Julian Cowan Hill becoming more relaxed and not getting upset about your tinnitus anymore calms down the CNS and this allows the brain to switch off the tinnitus and recruitment. Meditation and Chi Kung are excellent ways to relax the body.

      My life was a war against noise, by Kevin Barry


      http://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/my-life-was-a-war-against-noise-1.517024
       
    14. Lissa-Marie

      Lissa-Marie Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      08/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Antibiotics ,stress
      @Yvonne09 Hi Yvonne,

      I just left you a message. I went to your profile and left it there. i am new to the Forum so not sure how to navigate the page. I wanted to tell you that I am currently using the Luci and am i constant contact with Dr. Wilden's son,
      Amon Kaiser who now runs the facility in Baden Baden Germany. I wanted to speak to you because my situation is similar to yours. I can really use your support, please.

      I went to Sarasota Florida where there is now a place that has the Lumomed Laser. I did 15 treatments back in September and on October 6, I received the Luci and began using it 5 days a week for 30 minutes a day

      I just started using the laser yesterday after taking a two and a 1/2 week break because I have terrible headaches and the T had gotten worse. During the break things seemed to calm down but I didn't see much improvement.

      Since starting yesterday, I woke up this morning having doubts about continuing the treatment one because it has been 3 months in total that I have been in treatment with the exception of the month brake prior to receiving the laser. So it has been 2 months actively. Also, every doctor that I have seen has told me to not do it, to stop.

      I have had constant reassurance by Dr Kaiser that everything will be ok although he said I should have seen improvement by now and that the headaches are of a concern.

      I saw a Neurologist yesterday who prescribed me Gabapentin for my migraines but i dont know if I should take it. any suggestions for headaches?
       
    15. AUTHOR
      AUTHOR
      Yvonne09

      Yvonne09 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      Hi Lissa-Marie

      Apology for late answer, I can`t see any message in my inbox.

      Obviously I`m not an expert in LLLT, but there are some similarities to my experience. It actually started a little differently for me, because I started to use a portable device first (and I have no idea if Luci and Dr.Wildens`s device are the same or not) and I saw improvement immediately-within first few days. Do you have hyperacusis and/or pressure in the ears? Those had very clear improvement. T itself became thinner and softer. Then I was several times in Dr.Wilden`s office for treatment and I did some strong, therapeutic laser on my ears (it was not adviced by Dr.W). Every time after few days/weeks of these stronger treatments I had a spike in T which lasted between 2 weeks and 2 months. Perhaps this is what is happening to you since you started with an in-office treatment? Dr.W explains that this means that hearing cells are waking up/working/regenerating. After some time it usually calms down to sometimes to the same point as before, sometimes more quiet. Again it seems similar to your reaction. I am now at the point where I either don`t use anything when T is quite quiet or, when it spikes, I use portable devise (and from time to time I use this strong therapeutic LLL laser). If I were you I`d continue to use the portable devise only, for few months (stop or pause it if you don`t feel well) and see how it goes. I didn`t hear anyone to be harmed by laser but, again, I`m not a doctor (anyway doctors don`t know much either).

      My T first started with terrible headaches-I was actually bedridden for few months. I was in pain non stop. There are few things I did to help it. I was going during few months to a pain specialists and, after trying several things, she used some technic- not sure if I understood correctly, but it was something about suddenly releasing blood to the head. She tightly wrapped around my upper body some elastic bands, did some movements and then released the bands. Honestly-this day the headache stopped. However it would come back very strongly again when I was feeling weak, sick, etc, so I continued to search. I found another pain doctor, because I actually suffer from severe pain from trigger points (painful knots in the muscle). After few years of suffering from pain he injected anesthetics (licodaine I think) in trigger points and the pain went away. We did the same for headache. In the temples he injected licodaine as I have nasty trigger points there. In the back of the head where skull is attached to the neck he injected steroids- I didn`t have trigger points there but the muscles were inflamed. These area in the back of the head caused horrible pain in the front area. I could feel it very exactly when I pressed them. I had those injections one month ago, I felt relief, but will see if the results are permanent. I don`t know if you have the same problem but perhaps you might as well explore it. When I had acute headaches I used Sumatriptan (or something like this), but medications are not a solution for me. I didn`t notice that the laser I use for T had influence on my headaches (except for the strong therapeutic laser which relieved the inflamed points).

      As I mentioned earlier in my post LLLT helped a lot with my T to the point that I can function normally, but T is still there. Since T started I also developed some other symptoms like chronic fatigue, muscle pain, brain fog, etc. This perhaps doesn`t concern you, perhaps it concerns only a small amount of T sufferers (and perhaps I should write a separate post), but, since now I have other symptoms (and all tests show nothing wrong with me), I look into two more possible reasons for T. For those who are reading and want a scientifical evidence,etc, I don`t have any. Doctors and science don`t give me any answers so I`ll look into other options. Perahaps it can be helpful for people who, like me, have various, seemingly unrelated symptoms:

      -Epstein-Barr virus- I was sent this article and find it quite ineresting, especially the part about T :”Tinnitus, or ringing in the ear, is usually caused by EBV getting into the inner ear’s nerve channel, called the labyrinth. The ringing is the result of the virus inflaming and vibrating the labyrinth and the vestibulocochlear nerve.”

      https://goop.com/wellness/health/th...potentially-at-the-root-of-medical-mysteries/

      -breast implant illness (for those who doubt, this illness is very real): as per https://healingbreastimplantillness.com/breast-implant-symptoms/, ear ringing is one of the symptoms of the illness. I`ve been in touch with many women who had, amongst other symptoms, ear ringing. After having gotten rid of the implants, majority of them said that the T is gone or diminished. Not all of them unfortunately.

      Again I realise the above will not concern everyone (obviously) and might be completely dismissed by the community, but maybe it will help someone. After all not everyone has T from noise trauma or anything specific. I know I will be exploring these options now.

      It`s a long post. not sure if it helped you. Let us know how you are progressing I hope your T will at least improve like mine did.
       
    16. GregCA
      Jaded

      GregCA Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis
      I'd take Goop's "medical advice" with a grain of salt. It does not seem to have much credibility in serious/scientific circles. More here.
       
    17. John Meyers
      Artistic

      John Meyers Member

      Location:
      Chicago, IL
      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Just One (1) Loud Rock Concert!
      I found the following LED but where do I get the "heat sink" and "power supply"? This is all new to me. Thanks.

      https://www.ebay.com/itm/High-Power...Liabus9LOhOpND8NJyow:rk:2:pf:1&frcectupt=true
       
    18. Paul Dyson

      Paul Dyson Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/01/16
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Physical ten years ago followed by ototoxic damage in 2015
      Hi Yvonne, I’ve just started using a Konftec 660. I’m only 12 days in and I’m pretty sure I’m getting minor benefits already. I’ve had my T over 3 years and it was caused by acoustic trauma in one ear so I’m definitely in the chronic stage. My overall level decreased slightly on day 5 and seems to be getting flatter or thinner - so an annoying hard tone to more of a static sound. Also I seem to have some increased tolerance to loud noises e.g. car journeys. The improvement so far is only very minor, but it’s there. I suppose the could be a coincidental quiet patch but as mentioned before, my T definitely isn’t so easily spiked.
      I’ll report back after a month. I get the argument for LLLT not working when one’s T is chronic btw.
       
      • Informative Informative x 2
      • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
    19. Cher2

      Cher2 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      3/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      unknown
      Paul: can I ask how did you learn about the Konftec 660? How did you know which one to get? I went to their website to learn more, but I only learned about it originally by reading your post :)
       

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