Frequency Therapeutics — Hearing Loss Regeneration

Discussion in 'Research News' started by RB2014, Dec 8, 2016.

    1. Simon Czt

      Simon Czt Member

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma
      Hello,

      Last week, I went for a hearing test that went up to 12500 Hz, and the results showed that my audiogram was perfectly normal (just a "loss" of -10 dB at 12500 Hz).

      My question is, as my tinnitus appeared the day after a concert, so because of an acoustic trauma, and that in December 2018, I still had hearing losses in the low range from -20 dB to -25 dB, but that I technically "recovered" all my hearing; I wonder if I still have hidden hearing loss, and if by regenerating it, my tinnitus could disappear or decrease? Or if hidden hearing loss is different from "visible" hearing loss with regard to the principle of hearing regeneration?


      I would like an answer to these questions. :(
      Simple speculation :)

      And I'd like to know if you have a link, which shows that with this principle of regeneration, nerves grow back and eventually reattach themselves to the hairs cells? I've heard a lot about it, but I couldn't find any articles that talked about it.
       
      • Good Question Good Question x 1
    2. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      When you expose yourself to loud sounds, your supporting cells generate a lot of glutamate, which in large quantities causes glutamate excitotoxicity in your auditory nerve synapse. This is called the "glutamate storm". That could be the root of many of our tinnitus cases. This would explain tinnitus in people like you and I that have very little measurable hearing loss.

      If this is the case and our hair cells aren't dead, then I fail to see how FX-322 will help. There are other things like OTO-313 and OTO-413 that would be more likely to help.
       
      • Informative Informative x 3
    3. Simon Czt

      Simon Czt Member

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma
      Thank you for your answer ! :)

      Another thing bothers me, I feel like I don't have a speech-in-noise hearing difficulty. I have done several tests that have been found to be normal on this problem, but not perfect, hence my questioning. I hope that OTO-313 and OTO-413 can still help me with my tinnitus. I also know it appeared during a period of stress due to exams, but it mostly appeared the day after that damn concert.
       
    4. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      Well OTO-413 is for hidden hearing loss. We can only hope this helps our tinnitus. Some smart minds think it will. Maybe we have lost a few hair cells and the changes in the nerves will correct themselves upon restoration of input. That is what I am hoping.
       
      • Agree Agree x 5
    5. Simon Czt

      Simon Czt Member

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma
      Time and trials results will tell us! I can't wait. In the meantime, I'll keep taking curcumin.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
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    6. ChrisBoyMonkey

      ChrisBoyMonkey Member Podcast Patron

      Location:
      CA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      U.S. Army/Field Artillery Veteran / loud computer
      You should also look into Lenire and the Michigan device. These things are targetting tinnitus itself. I really don't mind any hearing loss I may have, as like yours it's barely noticeable if any. I just want the noise to be gone.
       
      • Agree Agree x 6
    7. Daniel Lion
      Ape-like

      Daniel Lion Member Benefactor

      Location:
      SE Asia
      Tinnitus Since:
      2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise trauma, hearing loss
      With the right to try legislation changed under the Trump administration, could @RB2014 or @GlennAz or myself have a good case to basically get in on a trial and get access to the small molecule drugs or biochemical innovations for the inner ear and nerve damage?

      Would it make sense to write a letter to the top brass from this company asking for access due to the debilitating nature of our hearing loss condition?

      Should tinnitus even be mentioned?
      The condition may be more advantageous to treat and more effectively argued separately.

      Could we do this as a group?

      What are the legal ramifications for access to hearing loss drugs?
       
      • Good Question Good Question x 10
    8. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      Would Frequency Therapeutics even agree to participate?
       
    9. Coleoptere
      Alone

      Coleoptere Member

      Location:
      The Hague
      Tinnitus Since:
      2002
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Bell's Palsy, hearing loss
      Not so sure you qualify for this law:

      Right-to-try laws are U.S. state laws and a federal law that were created with the intent of allowing terminally ill patients access experimental therapies (drugs, biologics, devices) that have completed Phase Itesting but have not been approved by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Prior to the passage of Right to try laws patients needed FDA approval to use experimental drugs. Requests were granted 99% of the time immediately over the phone or within a few days.

      Try to call the FDA if you think you do!

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-to-try_law
       
      • Informative Informative x 3
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    10. Daniel Lion
      Ape-like

      Daniel Lion Member Benefactor

      Location:
      SE Asia
      Tinnitus Since:
      2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise trauma, hearing loss
      You are correct, it probably won’t qualify after reading the wording in the link.
       
    11. Daniel Lion
      Ape-like

      Daniel Lion Member Benefactor

      Location:
      SE Asia
      Tinnitus Since:
      2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise trauma, hearing loss
      I believe if their product works they would consider it.

      I am sure they would be stoked to help people and get great publicity.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
    12. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      Go back about a year in this thread and MPP and you'll see how hard I was trying to argue for us to get organized to bring public attention to this (and how much effort certain people were exerting to shut me down).
       
      • Agree Agree x 3
    13. Ozwel
      Disappointed

      Ozwel Member

      Location:
      Paris, FR
      Tinnitus Since:
      2005
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Auditive trauma
      Hi, interesting reading from you. First time I read about that glutamate storm.

      And how would that storm induce something permanent?

      I haven’t read a lot about those two OTO drugs.

      I may give Curcumin a try with a few grams per day but I have tested so many things over the years... Curcumin included but it was as part of another cure for another problem (brain fog + vertigo) and with a dosage of <1g.

      I’ll have to learn about the OTO drugs anyway, it looks like it deserves some interest according to you. Right?
       
      • Like Like x 2
    14. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      Damnit. If any of these trial participants reported a lowering of tinnitus then that knowledge would be very helpful for the world of tinnitus research. They need to come out and just say yes or no for the sake of humanity.
       
      • Agree Agree x 5
      • Funny Funny x 1
    15. Rb86

      Rb86 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      5/31/19
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise
      I know right? All secretive. Just get on with it!
       
      • Agree Agree x 3
    16. Daniel Lion
      Ape-like

      Daniel Lion Member Benefactor

      Location:
      SE Asia
      Tinnitus Since:
      2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise trauma, hearing loss
      Agreed.
      If they only knew the degree of suffering.
      Maybe they do.
      Thank f%ck summer is ending and all the academics, scientists, and money makers will be back to work.
       
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    17. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      Why aren't we, as a community, demanding that these new ear drugs like FX-322, BDNF, NT-3 etc, be tested faster? There could literally be shit sitting on shelves right now that could restore most of us back to good health. BUT NO. We have to wait a year for each little tiny question to be answered and that's bullshit.
       
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    18. Rb86

      Rb86 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      5/31/19
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise
      Unfortunately every drug development is like this, down to real fatal ailments like cancer. Takes a lot of money and research to ensure there are no really bad side effects and that it's effective.
       
    19. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      Stop defending the status quo.
       
      • Agree Agree x 3
    20. Rb86

      Rb86 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      5/31/19
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise
      I'm not. But do you really think if they had the option to spend less money on research and be able to rush to market and start making money they wouldn't take that?

      It's there for a reason. God forbid they rushed it to market and it made you fully deaf with worse tinnitus, or some weird side effects like you lose your taste forever or something crazy.

      These things take time. Period.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
    21. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      IT DOES NOT NEED TO TAKE 1 YEAR TO DO A 3 MONTH STUDY.
       
      • Agree Agree x 5
    22. ajc

      ajc Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2002; spike 2009; worse 2017-18
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud music - noise damage
      But it does. You live in a fairy tale world where science and trials should happen at the speed of lightning, f**k the system, f**k the establishment, operate million dollar research projects and run trials in some backyard factory with no bureaucracy, yeah... that's not reality.

      1) Preparations, legal and medical
      2) Organizing trial sites, personnel
      3) Recruiting patients
      4) Running the trial (often a 3 month trial lasts 1 year or more because not everyone starts the trial on the same day, it runs continuously for a year or so)
      5) Analyzing the trial results
      6) Publishing the results, waiting for peer review (can take up to 6-9 months in the peer review queue)

      Capisce?
       
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    23. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      You're not going to convince me that it is as fast and efficient as it possibly can be, because it isn't. Capeeeesch? I know a woman that owns a biomedical device company that has moved several products to market and I have the exact same opinion of the system, especially the FDA, as she does.
       
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    24. Rb86

      Rb86 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      5/31/19
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise
      It is what it is my friend. Trust me. I want "out" of this just like you.

      Luckily, this medicine has gotten involved internationally, so I assume that bypasses any FDA red tape here in the United States.

      If it's legit, we'll know. Besides, results of the first trial is supposed to be released soon.

      Again, you have to understand, if they could be making profit quicker they would.

      Many promising medicines get lost in the pipeline due to lack of funding. That is not the case here. We're in good standing. Just chill.
       
      • Helpful Helpful x 1
    25. Ozwel
      Disappointed

      Ozwel Member

      Location:
      Paris, FR
      Tinnitus Since:
      2005
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Auditive trauma
      I'm coming to this thread every ~6 months and I'm amazed when I see posts here nearly everyday whereas Frequency Therapeutics may only publish some info twice a year.
       
    26. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      People talk about stuff. Go figure.
       
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    27. Coleoptere
      Alone

      Coleoptere Member

      Location:
      The Hague
      Tinnitus Since:
      2002
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Bell's Palsy, hearing loss
      We are in an in-between trial period of about half a year. Doing nothing... No parallel preps or so... fully agree with @JohnAdams.
       
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    28. Don Tinny

      Don Tinny Member

      Location:
      Argentina
      Tinnitus Since:
      2017 (worsening)
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud concert with ear plugs
      But the process doesn't work very well. There are a lot of drugs with permanent side effects, sadly.
       
      • Agree Agree x 4
    29. JohnAdams
      Murderous

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      here
      Tinnitus Since:
      it started.
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      hearing loss
      Exactly. That's one thing that the defenders of the system always fail to realize. I really cannot understand how or even why people would defend the the system the way it is now.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
    30. Rb86

      Rb86 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      5/31/19
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise
      Yeah, and those permanent side effect cases are either statistically experienced in small numbers, or the positive outweighs the negative.

      That also has nothing to do with the system. It's the drug itself.

      Some drugs might cause random side effects in 7 percent of people, while it's life changing in a positive way for the large majority. It's a risk you take.

      Stop complaining about the system. It's there for a reason.

      My Dad has been in the pharmaceutical industry his entire life. He's overseen therapies through trial to market. I have seen first hand the realities to why the system is the way it is.

      You have no ground.
       
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