Goldman Sachs Asks in Biotech Research Report: 'Is Curing Patients a Sustainable Business Model?'

Discussion in 'Awareness & Fundraising' started by annV, Apr 14, 2018.

    1. annV
      Fine

      annV Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2005
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      unknown - possibly hereditary
      https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/11/goldman-asks-is-curing-patients-a-sustainable-business-model.html

      Goldman Sachs analysts attempted to address a touchy subject for biotech companies, especially those involved in the pioneering "gene therapy" treatment: cures could be bad for business in the long run.

      "Is curing patients a sustainable business model?" analysts ask in an April 10 report entitled "The Genome Revolution."

      "The potential to deliver 'one shot cures' is one of the most attractive aspects of gene therapy, genetically-engineered cell therapy and gene editing. However, such treatments offer a very different outlook with regard to recurring revenue versus chronic therapies," analyst Salveen Richter wrote in the note to clients Tuesday. "While this proposition carries tremendous value for patients and society, it could represent a challenge for genome medicine developers looking for sustained cash flow."

      Richter cited Gilead Sciences' treatments for hepatitis C, which achieved cure rates of more than 90 percent. The company's U.S. sales for these hepatitis C treatments peaked at $12.5 billion in 2015, but have been falling ever since. Goldman estimates the U.S. sales for these treatments will be less than $4 billion this year, according to a table in the report.

      "GILD is a case in point, where the success of its hepatitis C franchise has gradually exhausted the available pool of treatable patients," the analyst wrote. "In the case of infectious diseases such as hepatitis C, curing existing patients also decreases the number of carriers able to transmit the virus to new patients, thus the incident pool also declines … Where an incident pool remains stable (eg, in cancer) the potential for a cure poses less risk to the sustainability of a franchise."

      The analyst didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.

      The report suggested three potential solutions for biotech firms:

      "Solution 1: Address large markets: Hemophilia is a $9-10bn WW market (hemophilia A, B), growing at ~6-7% annually."

      "Solution 2: Address disorders with high incidence: Spinal muscular atrophy (SMA) affects the cells (neurons) in the spinal cord, impacting the ability to walk, eat, or breathe."

      "Solution 3: Constant innovation and portfolio expansion: There are hundreds of inherited retinal diseases (genetics forms of blindness) … Pace of innovation will also play a role as future programs can offset the declining revenue trajectory of prior assets."
       
      • Like Like x 3
      • Winner Winner x 2
      • Funny Funny x 1
      • Informative Informative x 1
    2. SugarMagnolia
      Jaded

      SugarMagnolia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      This is not the first time I'm posting this and it probably won't be the last:

      "Ain't no money in the cure. The money's in the medicine." ~ Chris Rock.
       
      • Agree Agree x 6
    3. SugarMagnolia
      Jaded

      SugarMagnolia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      Business idea: Open lots of loud nightclubs to give people tinnitus and then clinics to cure people of tinnitus and then send them back to the nightclubs ad infinitum. :greedy:
       
      • Like Like x 2
      • Agree Agree x 1
    4. Alue
      No Mood

      Alue Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      01/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      This is why I wish there was more government funding going towards medical research. Government funded research is unique in the fact that they are less risk adverse because don't have to worry as much about making a profit in the short term. The US spends what $500 to $600 billion a year on military spending? Imagine if some of that taxpayer money went towards medical research.
       
      • Like Like x 4
      • Agree Agree x 2
      • Winner Winner x 1
    5. TheDanishGirl
      Sad

      TheDanishGirl Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Denmark
      Tinnitus Since:
      05/2017 (H since 06/2017)
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      long term noise exposure (headphones), maybe some stress.
      Personally I do not care if the "cure" is medicine or a one-time treatment. I would gladly gobble up pills worth a $100-a-month or more, if it took my tinnitus away....or just made it very mild and unable to get worse.....that is if there were no serious side effects, but a one-time treatment could also have side effects.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
    6. SugarMagnolia
      Jaded

      SugarMagnolia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      If you have to keep taking the pills, it's not a cure. And this is the point. We would all gobble up the pills if they helped even a little and the pharmaceutical company would have a customer for life. With a cure, they have a one-time only customer. So they have no incentive to develop a cure.

      I would post the video of Chris Rock, but it's full of curse words. You can find it by looking up "Chris Rock - Doctors & Drugs" on YouTube.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
    7. TheDanishGirl
      Sad

      TheDanishGirl Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Denmark
      Tinnitus Since:
      05/2017 (H since 06/2017)
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      long term noise exposure (headphones), maybe some stress.
      I will watch the video. I like Chris Rock :D

      And you are right, pills that you would have to keep taking, would not be a cure, but a treatment instead.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    8. SugarMagnolia
      Jaded

      SugarMagnolia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      This would also prevent unscrupulous pharmaceutical companies from raising their prices so high that many people can't afford their medication. In 2015, a pharmaceutical company raised the price of a life-saving drug from $13.50 per tablet to $750 per tablet.
       
    9. SugarMagnolia
      Jaded

      SugarMagnolia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      Me too.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    10. Niel S.
      Badass

      Niel S. Member

      Location:
      Belgium
      Tinnitus Since:
      Jan 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      That's not true in the case you are talking about. People who can't afford Daraprim can get the drug for only one dollar per pill. So it's not that people can't afford this medication anymore because of the drug price hike. No one had to suffer.

      Get your facts straight. I hate it when people just believe what the mainstream media is telling them without doing good research themselves.
       
    11. jay777

      jay777 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      benzo/ headphones
      • Like Like x 1
    12. SugarMagnolia
      Jaded

      SugarMagnolia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      If all the people who could afford $13.50 but can't afford $750 are getting it for $1, then the pharmaceutical company would be losing $12.50 per pill.
      I got my info from The New York Times. I consider that good research. I'm not an investigative journalist myself, so I rely on the research conducted by respected sources such as the NYT.
       
    13. Halsy

      Halsy Member

      Location:
      Toronto
      Tinnitus Since:
      Sept. 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Abscess tooth
      Those people are worse than Hitler. Fucking unreal. And of course the one thing they always fail to grasp in their psychopathic myopia is that sick people are a drag on the economy. A healthy, productive society is a far better thing to have than a crippled one. It's so self-evident that it's the assumption of not curing people to begin with is beyond asinine. Since my PT started it's cost the taxpayers of this province 10's of 1000's of dollars. And that cost is only going to keep increasing unless it resolves itself or they find a cure. It's not rocket surgery.
       
      • Agree Agree x 3
    14. PaulBe

      PaulBe Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Cairns
      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Probably sound, though never proven
      Goldman Sachs are the entry portal to the pits of Hell. Evil, malignant organization.
       
      • Agree Agree x 3
    15. Charles_T
      Insomnious

      Charles_T Member

      Location:
      California
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ototoxicity or Benzo Withdrawal
      This is the problem with the medical community and why I despise most doctors, big pharma, and the industry. If left to their own devices they would kill us all and sell the blood. We live in a sick world for sure.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    16. derpytia
      Pooptoast

      derpytia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Rescue, California
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2014
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Hearing loss / ETD
      What ***holes. People suffering from diseases and conditions that rob them of the ability to live life and these people only care about making money over a long period of time? I bet you that if these people got T or cancer or other chronic conditions like ehlers danlos or fibromyalgia they would eat their own words and beg for a cure despite how little money they would make over time.
       
      • Agree Agree x 5
    17. jeff W

      jeff W Member

      Location:
      nakatomi plaza
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2012
      • Like Like x 2
    18. Grey Dawn
      Assassinator

      Grey Dawn Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      Opiates make my sound decrease, good or bad. What about others?
       
    19. coffee_girl
      Innocent

      coffee_girl Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      All my life, but got worse 2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced / Concert
      This is just awful and depressing in so many ways, even if it is the reality of things. Money rules everything.
       
      • Agree Agree x 2
    20. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      As it should. If it didn't, the drugs and the medical procedures that we have access to today, would have never been developed in the first place.
       
    21. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      You do know that during the 20th century we have already had numerous countries proclaiming that the cures should be available to all, right? And you are aware of the fact that the progress stalled in those countries and then Nobody had any cures, right?
       
    22. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      So what you are basically saying above is that you expect others to work to promote your interests instead of working to promote their own interests. How is this different from slavery, and who is the ***hole here?
       
      • Funny Funny x 1
    23. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      Who would they sell the blood to? Also, would killing all of their customers really lead to them maximizing their profit?
       
    24. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      And by forcing the price back to $13.50, what do you think the government did to this firm's incentive to invest into R&D in the future?

      In any case, regarding "is it good business to come up with cures" horror story - in my opinion this is the result of the company not having enough competition.
       
    25. coffee_girl
      Innocent

      coffee_girl Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      All my life, but got worse 2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced / Concert
      Yes one can agree with the pillars of capitalism while still acknowledging its impact on society, runaway capitalism is only slightly better than the worst socialist societies. I don't believe anything should be ever be obtained for free but I feel that these kinds of business practices can only lead to worst forms of social injustice. A perfect society needs to have a good balance of free market incentives as well as social values. Too much Ayn Rand will tear at the fabric of society as much as too much Bernie Sanders can only create an invasive government. When it comes to health, the very talk of "let's not cure them, let's just create a life long dependency" is truly shocking to me.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    26. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      This analyst seems to be arguing that it is better to invest into cures for diseases like cancer, than to invest into cures for infectious diseases. Ultimately, this benefits the consumers too. See, as a consumer, you don't want the pharmaceutical companies and the firms that provide funding to them to lose money. The more money they make, the more willing they will be to invest money into more treatments (the more money they will Have to invest into those treatments). So the advice of this analyst seems to be ensuring that the number of cures and treatments produced by these firms in the Long run will be maximized.
       
      • Funny Funny x 1
    27. coffee_girl
      Innocent

      coffee_girl Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      All my life, but got worse 2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced / Concert
      For those interested in a very good debate between a pharmaceutical company and those against it, this video is totally worth the watch. It shows both sides and they argue very passionately about the topic.
      Blame Big Pharma for Out-of-Control Health...
       
    28. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      What do you mean by the term "runaway capitalism"?
      Why? How?
      See post #26 in this thread.

      Also, why are you not shocked by the decisions of the firms like GM and Apple. All of those firms had determined that it is not profitable for them to look for cures, and so they are not in the "cure" business. How is their decision different from the decision of Goldman-Sachs to invest their money elsewhere?
       
    29. derpytia
      Pooptoast

      derpytia Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Rescue, California
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2014
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Hearing loss / ETD
      1. You're kinda breaking the terms and conditions rule number two here with that last bit.
      2. I stand by what I said. It isn't wrong to wish that people showed more compassion in their line of work.
      3. Goldman-Sachs has a decidedly dodgy history and I'm not the only one who despises them and their business practices.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    30. Bill Bauer
      No Mood

      Bill Bauer Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      February, 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trauma
      U.S. national debt is out of control.
      http://www.usdebtclock.org/
      Paying down the national debt would benefit all Americans. So why are you using your personal savings in a way that would benefit you, instead of paying down the national debt, and helping everyone? You are worse than Hitler - fucking unreal, is what it is.
       

Share This Page