Notched Music Therapy (DIY, AudioNotch, etc.)

Discussion in 'Treatments' started by Scarred, Mar 16, 2011.

    1. Fabrikat

      Fabrikat Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1973
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis then volume then viral infection
      Does that mean modulating sounds would be ineffective with pure tone tinnitus or does that mean one would need to boost the volume surrounding the tinnitus frequency?
       
    2. Steve
      Creative

      Steve Member Benefactor Hall of Fame Advocate

      Location:
      Sheffield, UK
      Tinnitus Since:
      2003
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Flu, Noise-induced, Jaw trauma
      If you have tonal tinnitus you will get the most benefit from amplitude modulation with a tone matching your tinnitus. If you want to notch you need a tone that has good representation across the frequency spectrum. You can still use the amplitude modulation on a broadband sound with a notch. It will be interesting to see the effect but there isn't any current research to support it.

      There is research which is from a PhD that I talked to recently, with success from amplitude modulated broadband noise. I'll ask her about it, see if I can publish any data or a comment.
       
    3. Fabrikat

      Fabrikat Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1973
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis then volume then viral infection
      Thanks @Steve! So rather than avoiding the frequency tone, we now focus on it, but modulate it. Broadband modulation sounds like it would benefit the many people who do not have tonal tinnitus, if I've understood rightly. I'd love to see the PhD's results. Sounds very encouraging!
       
    4. Steve
      Creative

      Steve Member Benefactor Hall of Fame Advocate

      Location:
      Sheffield, UK
      Tinnitus Since:
      2003
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Flu, Noise-induced, Jaw trauma
      Yes I think that's right, when you can't identify a tone try broadband noises for these sorts of techniques. Although that is just my opinion.

      I wouldn't say that there is a change in technique. Some audio therapy uses the tinnitus tone, some uses sound around it and avoids the tone. It's likely that you have to try a few ideas out and see which one works best for you.

      I've asked the question on the results but she is very near to handing the thesis in so may take a little time to respond.
       
    5. GregCA
      Jaded

      GregCA Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis
      Keep in mind that there could be dangers related to prolonged exposure to a single frequency sound (i.e. a tone, albeit amplitude modulated). I remember reading a long time ago (waaaay before my T) that these types of sounds were to avoid because all of their energy was focused on a single frequency, which means that all the mechanical energy ended up focused on one very small part of the cochlea, which could potentially have damaging effects.
      It's a bit like a laser: it's so focused that even a small amount of power can do quite some damage.
      I do not have any scientific paper to back it up: as I said this is what I remember from decades ago, but I'd be cautious about very focused signals for long periods of time. I know I'm shying away from them, especially because the "T" area could easily map the part of the cochlea that is already hurt.
       
    6. Fabrikat

      Fabrikat Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1973
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis then volume then viral infection
      Then you have things like the Levo system, which apparently focuses on the tinnitus frequency, I believe. Yet notching theory says not to do that. ACRN doesn't do it either. It's a bit confusing. To frequency focus or not to frequency focus, that is the question it seems, when it comes to home based sound therapies.
       
    7. GregCA
      Jaded

      GregCA Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis
      I'm not sure they just focus on that. It's not clear what the main program is, but their FDA filing specifies "amplitude modulated tinnitus pitch matched tones, narrow-band noise centered at the tinnitus frequency, and broad-band noise."
       
    8. Fabrikat

      Fabrikat Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1973
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis then volume then viral infection
      From that description, it sounds like they are similar in aspects to the study using amplitude modulated sounds. There's not a lot of talk on TT about Levo or its rate of success. I'm presuming it's low, otherwise our community would be shouting its praises from the rooftops.
       
    9. Samir
      Obedient

      Samir Manager Staff Benefactor Ambassador Advocate

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Accoustic trauma
      Could someone translate this to English please?

      Narrow... yet broad...
       
    10. Samir
      Obedient

      Samir Manager Staff Benefactor Ambassador Advocate

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Accoustic trauma
      This is how I picture the Levo thing to work, given the description above.

      Levo.png

      It doesn't look too complicated when you look at it this way. Of course, a picture does say more than words. But I have no clue if this is what is really going on with the Levo system.
       
    11. GregCA
      Jaded

      GregCA Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis
      Yeah except you've got your domains mixed: you are in the frequency domain for your broad band and narrow band spectral distributions, but you are in the time domain for your amplitude modulated signal. You can't mix data from both sides of the "FFT mirror" on the same graph. Well, you can but... it doesn't make much sense.
       
      • Genius Genius x 1
    12. GregCA
      Jaded

      GregCA Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis
      It's confusing indeed. Maybe these are 3 different "modes of operation" that don't play simultaneously.
       
    13. Samir
      Obedient

      Samir Manager Staff Benefactor Ambassador Advocate

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Accoustic trauma
      Yeah, that could be. I wish we knew more about it so we could try something like this home made. It should not be too difficult to recreate.
       
    14. sharonr

      sharonr Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      noise
      Hi, i am considering trying notched music therapy. At the moment i am doing sound therapy international and want to continue with it.

      My question is can i do them both at the same time.

      I do sound therapy in the morning and would do notch music therapy at night.

      Thank you.
       
    15. Pleasure_Paulie

      Pleasure_Paulie Member

      Location:
      Australia
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise or maybe... unicorns!
      My understanding is the more you do the better the end result so why not do sound therapy intentional in the morning and the night? Evaluate it after a few months and see if it’s helping? if not, try notch.
       
    16. sharonr

      sharonr Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      noise
      Thank you so much for your help. It puts my mind at ease by doing them both together.
      Thanks
      Sharon.
       
    17. Pleasure_Paulie

      Pleasure_Paulie Member

      Location:
      Australia
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise or maybe... unicorns!
      My suggestion was to give 100% to one method and evaluate over a few months.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    18. sharonr

      sharonr Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      noise
      Sorry i read it wrong.
      Thank you
      Sharon.
       
    19. Ike J

      Ike J Member

      Location:
      Michigan
      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      possible noise induced hearing loss
      Can anyone comment on how to implement James White's approach to notching all output from a MAC using the latest version of GarageBand (or similar approaches). I can't seem to find the AUparametric equalizer plug-in described in the original post
       
    20. bellafjelle
      Angelic

      bellafjelle Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2006
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Assault which perforated my ear drum (Spike 2017 unknown)
      Hello,

      My tinnitus is around 12400 Hz.

      I'm playing around with Notched White Noise Therapy and have a question. My Notch is between 8794 Hz and 17588 Hz, but I have some age-related hearing loss beyond 14000 Hz so will this technique still work?
       
    21. meeb
      Sad

      meeb Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2002
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      loud clubs initially, now louder due to noise & vibrations.
      I really want to do this but it jsut looks like stress trying to figure out how to do it. Shame.
       
    22. MBH

      MBH Member

      Location:
      Upstate NY
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Overloaded stress
      Has anyone heard of signal notch therapy? I heard they had success. Just wondering about it?
       
    23. GregCA
      Jaded

      GregCA Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis
      What is the "signal notch therapy" you are mentioning? The only hit I get on google is this page.
       
    24. MBH

      MBH Member

      Location:
      Upstate NY
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Overloaded stress
      My ear person mention it to me, it based on finding your tone and hearing your tone in your ear. It is by leanne powers. I'm going to read more about it but I'm not as hip as this site is about treatment. It might be a possibility.
       
    25. GregCA
      Jaded

      GregCA Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otosclerosis
      I think you may be confused with Signia Tinnitus Therapy. It's a habituation process, which is somewhat unrelated to Notched Music Therapy.
       
    26. MBH

      MBH Member

      Location:
      Upstate NY
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Overloaded stress
      Ok thanks for looking into it.
       
    27. morgothaod

      morgothaod Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2009
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear infection
      Can someone notch an hour long music file for me? When I use audacity and enter the Nyquist Prompt section, I get "Not responding" after entering the (vector (notch2 (aref s 0) 13000 1) (notch2 (aref s 1) 13000 1) ) command. My trial for Cool Edit expired and I can't save the file (When I reinstall Cool Edit it still says my trial expired). SIGH

      I think my tinnitus is at 13000

      My low and high numbers are
      9219
      18439
       
    28. morgothaod

      morgothaod Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2009
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear infection
      Thanks, I also found an app called "Tinnitus Therapy Tunes." It notches all my songs on my phone and lets me listen for 20 minutes/day. If I pay $9.99 I get unlimited use. Do you guys have any tips for finding your tinnitus frequency? I have a bit of trouble telling if my tinnitus is an "eeeeeeeeeee" (Like 9000) or an "eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee" (11000+) if that makes any sense!
       
    29. Ambassador
      Cool

      Ambassador Member

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      June 2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      High frequency hearing loss and lifetime noise exposure
      I have found it's very difficult to find my frequency, I think I'm close but not sure. It's not like you can ask for a second opinion. I find the range between 8K and 11K works well for me.
       
    30. bellafjelle
      Angelic

      bellafjelle Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2006
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Assault which perforated my ear drum (Spike 2017 unknown)
      Hello,

      I have a question about the notch that applies to notched music therapy/notched white noise therapy.

      A person has a tinnitus frequency at 13000 hz. He makes a notch between 12000 and 14000 hz. However, this person has an age-related hearing loss at frequencies above 14000 hz. Probably around 10-15 dB.

      Do this person have to be able to hear the frequencies at the end of the notch for the therapy to work?

      (Moderators: is there any way possible you can let this post stay in the normal support forum? It seems like the notched thread is kinda dead since noone really responds to questions)
       

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