New Trial: An fMRI investigation of the Effects of Lidocaine on Tinnitus

Discussion in 'Research News' started by LostOutWest, Dec 11, 2019.

    1. LostOutWest
      Not amused

      LostOutWest Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      Hi - I've been reading more about Lidocaine as a potentially effective tinnitus suppression therapy. It appears that Massachusetts Ear & Eye is trying to advance their understanding of this drug's efficacy for tinnitus with a new clinical trial that has not yet started recruiting. They are looking for tinnitus patients with normal hearing, and hearing loss, so it's quite inclusive. Looks to be a one-day event.

      Lidocaine has shown some promise, but I believe further research is needed to prove safety and efficacy, longer term. However, it is good to know that it is available already and in the market.

      https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04192773?recrs=abf&cond=tinnitus&draw=2&rank=8
       
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    2. ajc

      ajc Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2002; spike 2009; worse 2017-18
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud music - noise damage
      Lidocaine helps tonnes of headringers but its effect is short lived and you can't be hooked up on it 24/7.
       
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    3. AUTHOR
      AUTHOR
      LostOutWest
      Not amused

      LostOutWest Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      Hopefully they'll learn something new that will help advance our understanding, leading to a safe therapy.
       
    4. ChrisBoyMonkey

      ChrisBoyMonkey Member Podcast Patron

      Location:
      US
      Tinnitus Since:
      2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise
      This is actually a good idea.

      Putting lidocaine in us and using an fMRI to see exactly what parts of the brain it's affecting when it quiets ringing could be very useful to finding treatments, and refine the ones that are already underway.
       
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    5. Pawel1
      No Mood

      Pawel1 Member

      Location:
      Marlow
      Tinnitus Since:
      2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud bang
      From what I remember, Lidocaine is toxic, and it can't be used too many times. It's a strong anesthetic used to numb the inner mouth, when a person gets a dentist's treatment. Lidocaine is injected into your teeth gums or something like that.

      I think it would be great if they could do a re-make of Lidocaine, just like Dr. Tzaunopaulos is re-making one of the drugs for epilepsy. Such a Lidocaine-remake could be injected into your mouth, and still work on Tinnitus, and not necessarily be injected into your ears. So, you could easily inject this, every 24 hours, and be sure that your Tinnitus doesn't come back.

      Some people on this forum have had Lidocaine injections. I found this article:
      https://www.newswise.com/articles/lidocaine-relieves-tinnitus-sufferers
      It's a clinical study, which seems to show that Lidocaine provides an complete or partial Tinnitus relief for the vast majority of the study participants.


      My guess is, that Lidocaine, which is anesthetic, it somehow silences the electrical impulses coming from the wrongly wired or damaged auditory nerves, therefore your Tinnitus decreases. Because, is it a coincidence, that half of your face basically goes numb and you can't feel pain in there, but at the same time, your Tinnitus decreases? I don't think so. Tinnitus is physical and it's related with brain inflammation.
       
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    6. FGG
      No Mood

      FGG Member Podcast Patron Benefactor Hall of Fame Advocate

      Tinnitus Since:
      01/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Multi-factorial
      In addition to being a local anesthetic, Lidocaine decreases glutamate release and antagonizes the NMDA receptor. I don't think it works by reducing brain inflammation. I think it works in a similar way to what OTO-313 is trying to do (more safely than lidocaine).
       
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    7. JohnAdams
      Festive

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Vatican
      Tinnitus Since:
      May 1st 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Aspirin Toxicity/Possibly Noise
      Exactly. This is the type of research that is needed, not more psychology crap about personality traits.
       
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    8. JohnAdams
      Festive

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Vatican
      Tinnitus Since:
      May 1st 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Aspirin Toxicity/Possibly Noise
      So I wonder if cocaine will silence tinnitus, since it has numbing effects like lidocaine?

      Asking for a friend.
       
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    9. FGG
      No Mood

      FGG Member Podcast Patron Benefactor Hall of Fame Advocate

      Tinnitus Since:
      01/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Multi-factorial
      I did a brief search and it looks like Coke, unlike lidocaine, can stimulate the Glutamate receptors, theoretically could make tinnitus worse.
       
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    10. DaveN
      No Mood

      DaveN Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      9/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ramsay Hunt Syndrome
      I emailed one of the contacts about the nature of the study and being potentially interested in volunteering, they replied within 5 minutes and said "This study is not a treatment study as we are looking for neural changes in the brain related to tinnitus, but your participation may help us understand tinnitus further and allow us to look into future treatment that will help our tinnitus patients. Please let me know if you have any other questions!"
       
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    11. AUTHOR
      AUTHOR
      LostOutWest
      Not amused

      LostOutWest Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      It definitely doesn’t. At least that’s what my friend told me. It does the opposite. Said my friend.
       
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    12. peter91

      peter91 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      Nov 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      cocaine with anabolic steroids + HGH
      Bumping up. Wouldn't recommend cocaine. Got mild-to-moderate (sometimes it gets me so annoyed that I think it's severe, although it's not) tinnitus in Nov 2019 from that thing.

      I overdosed, thank god I am alive. Won't ever touch that thing again (promised to myself). If I ever knew...
       
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    13. Pawel1
      No Mood

      Pawel1 Member

      Location:
      Marlow
      Tinnitus Since:
      2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud bang
      I don't think there are many people (If any) who have injected cocaine into their ears. I'm not saying it's a good idea, but maybe in the future, the scientists will find out if injecting numbing stuff into your ears, would silence tinnitus.

      I guess, we have to wait for the results of this study.

      Btw, I feel the same like you peter91. My tinnitus is mild-moderate, but sometimes it sounds really loud and I've got some mental health issues, so sometimes I'm just suicidal.
       
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    14. mrbrightside614

      mrbrightside614 Member Podcast Patron Benefactor Advocate

      Location:
      NE Ohio, USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      July 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma
      The thing is, with NMDA receptor antagonists, I feel that they’d only be effective in the acute window (during initial genesis of the tinnitus). That’s probably why @ChrisBoyMonkey didn’t experience any relief, and why memantine is ineffective in chronic cases. I literally have no clue why lidocaine would be so effective, unless it’s extremely strong and the damaged cochlea continues to release glutamate, and chronic tinnitus is a consequence of continuous glutamate release. It may be that lidocaine can “clear” the system of glutamate by overcoming the threshold of glutamate release via exceptionally strong NMDA antagonist activity, but its short-acting nature allows the tinnitus to reform shortly after administration.
       
    15. peter91

      peter91 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      Nov 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      cocaine with anabolic steroids + HGH
      I have read your story, you are worrying about it too much man. I mean, yes you can't do anything about it right now but, huh, you are young and science is gonna make it some day a lot better. Just patience, and relax, man.

      Seems like you need to read about Back to Silence technique: Don't measure your tinnitus volume. Rather measure how you feel about it. That's counter-intuitive but helps a LOT.

      Deep Brain stimulation and other breakthrough things are going to help if, in worst case, it won't go away.

      My tinnitus is loud when I am in complete silence listening it, and some frequencies come and go.
      First month was horrible and I was almost crying but one day I said:
      "I am going to go with it, there is nothing I can do anyway! God gives you bearable struggles."

      Try Pharma GABA maybe, L-Theanine and Ashwagandha combined for a month. This might help your nerves calm down. Also Magnesium could help.

      P.S. Wouldn't say I have no mental issues having overdoses and almost passed away two months ago.

      Cheers
       
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    16. Bill Arsenault

      Bill Arsenault Member

      Location:
      Boston.
      Tinnitus Since:
      Permanent and severe since 2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Medication / Noise Over Exposure
      Also- cocaine is processed with some extremely nasty chemicals- such as diesel fuel, Ect...

      You definitely want to stay away from all street drugs- they use anything and everything to “Cut” that crap- and most of it is toxic.

      Most potent pharmaceuticals are not any better in my experience- but for whatever reason I am highly susceptible to Ototoxicity.

      I know others don’t seem to have this issue.
      I guess there’s a guy who runs a tinnitus forum on Facebook who promotes using a cocktail of Zanax and Gabapentin.

      Both of those drugs are in The top 10 for causing tinnitus and for good reason - but others find them to be a lifesaver for coping with intrusive tinnitus.

      One thing is for sure- Tinnitus continues to baffle anyone who tries to figure it out.
       
    17. mrbrightside614

      mrbrightside614 Member Podcast Patron Benefactor Advocate

      Location:
      NE Ohio, USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      July 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma
      Still not recruiting.

      Still no cocaine.

      In all seriousness, if I got temporary suppression of my tinnitus, the last thing I’d want to do is hop in an MRI and endanger myself. Hope they get some valuable information out of the brave subjects though.
       
    18. DanielleBD

      DanielleBD Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      Childhood
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      It looks like the page has been updated, it still says that the new study start date is May 2020, so hopefully they'll start recruiting soon.

      Does anybody know if IV lidocaine is ototoxic? A possible temporary silence is so tempting, but I'm afraid to volunteer and make my tinnitus worse.
       
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    19. peter91

      peter91 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      Nov 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      cocaine with anabolic steroids + HGH
      Hey, how is it going?
       
    20. DaveN
      No Mood

      DaveN Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      9/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ramsay Hunt Syndrome
      Hi all, not sure if people are checking the trial page but I emailed and have actually heard back from them. They are recruiting. I have a phone screening on Wednesday to see if I am eligible. I was/am nervous about it as well because I am not a fan of MRI's (the study involves having 2 of them) and am also worried about possible side effects, but I think it would be good for my mental health to feel like I am in some indirect way helping even if I don't get immediate help from it. I've been a bit angry and down lately and I think this potentially came just at the right time for me.
       
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    21. Piney

      Piney Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      March 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Shingles virus
      Keep us posted on the effects.
       
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    22. Pitseleh

      Pitseleh Member

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      2007
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      Careful with MRIs...
      I would avoid them at all cost unless vital necessity.
      They are extremely loud, even with double protection.
      My already bad tinnitus turned hell after a brain MRI, although I was wearing earplugs+earmuffs.
       
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    23. DaveN
      No Mood

      DaveN Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      9/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ramsay Hunt Syndrome
      When I had Ramsay Hunt I had to have back-to-back brain MRI's. Definitely not something I would say is enjoyable for sure. Yeah I have been weighing what to do. The two I had a few years ago didn't really impact my tinnitus but it wasn't exactly something I would run back to to try again. Tough choice for sure, but I am leaning towards doing it for the prospect of having some slight even temporary silence. If I don't get that, then who knows, maybe just taking part in the study and the potential of being able to help people down the line will be enough for me.

      Thanks for your concern :) I will keep everyone posted. I have my call tomorrow so I'll try to remember some notes from the call and keep y'all posted.
       
    24. antonio77

      antonio77 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1991
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      unknown
      DaveN,

      Do you know if it is a silent MRI?
       
    25. DaveN
      No Mood

      DaveN Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      9/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ramsay Hunt Syndrome
      Good question, they didn't mention that. I will absolutely make sure to ask during the phone screening!
       
    26. antonio77

      antonio77 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1991
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      unknown
      DaveN,

      There are silent MRIs, from Hitachi, Canon, Toshiba and GE.

      Postscript:
      I use a translator and it didn't come out exactly how I wanted to say it.
       
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    27. DaveN
      No Mood

      DaveN Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      9/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ramsay Hunt Syndrome
      Just got off the phone. It was about 20 minutes in total. They start by asking if you have any questions.
      They did confirm they will be using standard fMRI machines and not a silent one unfortunately. But they did say they will be using noise cancelling headphones... I don't know if anyone has had good luck with those in the past. My last MRI they gave me regular headphones which did nothing but make me annoyed they were even offered.

      After some basic contact/general info about you, here are some of the questions I was asked:
      • Are you currently/have ever been treated for a psychiatric disorder?
      • Are you currently/have ever been treated for a neurological disorder?
      • Do you consider yourself right or left handed?
      • When did your tinnitus start/when were you diagnosed?
      • Is your tinnitus bi-lateral?
      • Do you have a history of fainting?
      • Do you have any tattoos?
      • Have you ever had an MRI?
      • Any dental implants or major dental work?
      • Any TMJ surgery/treatment?
      • A few questions about if you have had any stents/implants/rods etc presently in you.
      Pretty sure that was most of what we discussed... My apologies, I was 'in a work meeting' and taking this call at the same time on the fly so I will post more questions if I can think of any.
       
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    28. asey20
      Curious

      asey20 Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Toronto
      Tinnitus Since:
      July 13, 2020
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Not sure.
      Why does it matter if you are right or left handed? Asking because I am left handed and it'd be depressing if somehow being left handed makes tinnitus less treatable/cureable in the future. :(
       
    29. DaveN
      No Mood

      DaveN Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      9/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ramsay Hunt Syndrome
      I am semi-ambidextrous so that made me nervous as well. I am going to wait and see, apologies I should have pressed a bit on why this question was part of the screening. When I hear from them next I will try to remember to ask and pass this along!
       
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    30. DaveN
      No Mood

      DaveN Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      9/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ramsay Hunt Syndrome
      I did not qualify.

      I was told for the purposes of the study they needed right handed people.
       

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