Lenire — Bimodal Stimulation Treatment by Neuromod

Discussion in 'Treatments' started by Tinnitus Talk, Apr 20, 2019.

    1. JohnAdams
      Festive

      JohnAdams Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Vatican
      Tinnitus Since:
      May 1st 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Aspirin Toxicity/Possibly Noise
      There is no available evidence for or against it being a placebo.

      How can they provide something they cannot obtain? And how does their inability to do so in anyway reinforce your argument?
       
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    2. friend74
      Doubtful

      friend74 Member

      Location:
      Germany
      Tinnitus Since:
      1994
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud Music
      No, but I guess I should as I won't like to pay 1000€ for the 1st appointment in Hannover (although it's just 2 hours by car).
       
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    3. Lurius
      Wishful

      Lurius Member

      Location:
      Oslo, Norway
      Tinnitus Since:
      September 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown, but probably stress
      I'm wondering this too, as they told me I would hear from them by the end of November. Any information you can share would be appreciated. If I don't hear anything this week, I might call them again.
       
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    4. Pawel1
      Wishful

      Pawel1 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      January 2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud Music
      There is some physical evidence that Lenire works. One of the users has said that his tinnitus decreased, and his improvement was actually measured at his final visit at Neuromod office. I don't know if other users also have actually measured their decrease in tinnitus.

      I think that it could be harder to measure the intensity of person's tinnitus, rather than the loudness. For example, if you have 10 different sounds in your tinnitus, and Lenire decreases the loudness of one of those sounds, can you measure the improvement in your tinnitus? Some people on this forum would just say that you're experiencing placebo effect.
       
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    5. Sytex75
      Wisdomatic

      Sytex75 Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Merritt Island Florida
      Tinnitus Since:
      1/1/15
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Working aircraft on tarmacs
      I wonder if a placebo effect can last for a very long time? Our minds are quite the mystery...
       
    6. Sironketchup

      Sironketchup Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Stress
      No, a few days ago they told me they are going to email me as soon as possible for 2020 appointments.

      I don't think asking again would change anything, maybe even annoy them or block their capacities.

      Let's hope we will hear from them in December!
       
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    7. Tybs

      Tybs Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Fall from stairs
      It's as close as we can get to evidence right now, but the current measurement methods are lacking in one thing: they measure the patient's findings, which are subjective.

      There still is no foolproof way to objectively measure the exact sounds that a person is hearing. I guess this is one of the reasons that so many ENTs stay away from tinnitus development as far as possible. At least pain is clearly recognizable for everyone, but sound? It's already hard to describe exactly what one hears, never mind the lack of objective data...

      Not saying that I doubt the testimonies or the bimodal process itself. This is still the field that looks most promising IMO when it comes to a cure. I just hope some true objective measurement technique surfaces eventually, so that there can no longer be any doubt as to whether a treatment has effect or not.
       
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    8. Krolo

      Krolo Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999 , Worse in September 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud Volume
      I do wonder if EEG measurements before and after would be an indicator for what is happening. According to a paper by Sven Vanneste and others there were some EEG similarities between tinnitus and depression.
       
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    9. Jack Straw
      Balanced

      Jack Straw Member Podcast Patron Benefactor Ambassador Hall of Fame Advocate

      Location:
      US
      Tinnitus Since:
      1990s
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Infection, Acoustic Trauma
      Can someone give me a TLDR of recent events with Lenire?

      I have been following the User Experiences thread, but not this one. Based on that thread it seems to be hit or miss, but certain timings work better for others. Has Neuromod confirmed personalizing the treatment more?
       
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    10. Tybs

      Tybs Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Fall from stairs
      Would be quite intesting indeed.

      Unfortunately, there is no way to accurately predict whether someone will get tinnitus or not. Still, it should be possible to invite a X amount of adults that are physically fine for a test, and do a new test a few years later to check for changes. Statistically, at least some of them should have obtained tinnitus: the others could serve as an indicator whether observed changes happen in a regular person as well.

      With an objective measurement, some people might finally shut up about it all being between the ears... well, figuratively. Literally the issue actually exists there, of course :rolleyes:
       
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    11. TibuJenkins

      TibuJenkins Member Podcast Patron

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear wax removal with suction by ENT
      You're better off making up your own "facts" than relying on this thread.
       
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    12. Krolo

      Krolo Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Sweden
      Tinnitus Since:
      1999 , Worse in September 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud Volume
      It's not so much about the prediction. Relating to Lenire and other treatments for tinnitus it would be interesting what effect it has on the signaling of the brain. Since we can measure it and at least Brai3n in Belgium has an array of different tinnitus treatment options and are apparently on the way to offer Lenire + Sven recently moved to Dublin to work on further subtyping of tinnitus, my bet is that using EEG will give us a better picture of wtf is happening. Would love if it was to be incorporated into Lenire to datamine us patients to get a better understanding. Sadly we are in commercial territory in a way...
       
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    13. ChrisBoyMonkey

      ChrisBoyMonkey Member Podcast Patron

      Location:
      CA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      U.S. Army/Field Artillery Veteran
      There have been more successful updates on this thread showing further progress for some of the users themselves or if not from members who know others that are using the device.

      It seems Neuromod is using PS1 setting for most the first time, then PS4, then back to PS1 again, as they have said this was their most successful setting.
       
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    14. threefirefour
      Rebellious

      threefirefour Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      California
      Tinnitus Since:
      5/15/16
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      140dB B R U H moment
      PS1 seems to be the juice. Whenever people switch to PS4 it's usually not as good but it usually still works, it's mostly to keep PS1 effective.

      FWIW Tinnitus Talk also has been collecting data from people who tried Lenire, and their numbers are way more impressive than mine, with 40 people instead of 24. Basically, the success rate is pretty good like many in the thread have been saying, but there is a feature besides hyperacusis that's correlated with higher reduction rates. They can't say however because it may tamper with future data collection.
       
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    15. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown, viral?
      It makes me wonder, especially with the costs involved in international travel, whether a 6 week timeout on PS1 would serve the same purpose of dehabituating the brain as turning on and off PS4 for 6 weeks.
       
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    16. ChrisBoyMonkey

      ChrisBoyMonkey Member Podcast Patron

      Location:
      CA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      U.S. Army/Field Artillery Veteran
      I have a feeling the next appointments will be rolling out very soon ;)
       
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    17. Lurius
      Wishful

      Lurius Member

      Location:
      Oslo, Norway
      Tinnitus Since:
      September 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown, but probably stress
      I was offered an appointment today, finally after waiting for so long. It's on the 4th of February. Obviously, I'm going to accept.
       
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    18. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown, viral?
      I just got mine, January 17th. Now I need to do a gut check.
       
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    19. Wimais

      Wimais Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      1/01/2001
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      Hi everybody,

      I received my invitation today. I want to try it but are the results good enough to take the risk?

      Last time I paid for therapy in Germany, low-level laser therapy thing for 2200€... To be honest I'm a bit scared to be fooled again...

      I also have hearing loss in the ear where I have my tinnitus. So it might be possible to not be accepted for Lenire at the end...
       
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    20. Sironketchup

      Sironketchup Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Stress
      So happy to hear it's going forward guys!
      When did you sign up? I signed up end of June, so hopefully gettin' my appointment soon, too!

      HOPE be with you!
       
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    21. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown, viral?
      Gut check complete. I am hopefully scheduled on the 17th of January.

      I view it as a 30% chance of a game changing difference, a 35% of minor improvement, and a 35% chance of being a non-responder. Ultimately the cost and effort is worth a 30% chance of getting my life back and even a minor improvement depending on what that sounds like could be enough to help me live life better while waiting the two years for Susan Shore's product to hit the market.
       
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    22. Ruse
      No Mood

      Ruse Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      NIHL & TMJ
      6th March!
       
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    23. uae96
      Thinking

      uae96 Member

      Location:
      Dubai
      Tinnitus Since:
      6/14/2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise induced
      I have my appointment on January 23rd.
       
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    24. LostOutWest
      Conehead

      LostOutWest Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      @AfroSnowman @Lurius would you be so kind as to reminding us when you submitted your interest to Neuromod? I believe it was summer, 2019, but helpful for folks on this list to understand potentially where they may be in the line. Thank you!
       
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    25. nuno1976
      Jaded

      nuno1976 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unkown
      Hi guys,

      I also got my appointment.
      It will be on the 27th of February.
      It was a long wait... I made my booking at 7th June.
      First appointment will be 250€.

      Can you please remind me the appointment process? When will the second payment be?

      Thanks.
       
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    26. TibuJenkins

      TibuJenkins Member Podcast Patron

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear wax removal with suction by ENT
      Got my appointment for March 2020. Which is great as I receive my yearly bonus that month. I would love it if by that time it would be possible to do the initial screening and receive the device in a two week window to avoid a double or triple trip, but I doubt it would be possible.
       
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    27. JohnK
      Busy

      JohnK Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      10/26/2015 (habituated) 5/13/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Doxycycline (2015) Otimize ear drops [neomycin] (2019)
      I just got off the waitlist! Appointment in January!

      27d.jpg
       
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    28. AliceW

      AliceW Member

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      02/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic trauma - loud noise
      My appointment to pick up Lenire has been advanced to next Thursday! Initially it was the 20th of December and now the 10th!
       
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    29. threefirefour
      Rebellious

      threefirefour Member Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      California
      Tinnitus Since:
      5/15/16
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      140dB B R U H moment
      Amazing.
       
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    30. ChrisBoyMonkey

      ChrisBoyMonkey Member Podcast Patron

      Location:
      CA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      U.S. Army/Field Artillery Veteran
      For most people the results aren't complete silence level, but it is helping most by some reduction of volume, change of pitch, making it easier to mask and forget about in day to day life, etc. There is a small minority that it may not help much, but the overall the odds are still much in our favor for at least some reduction.

      You can look over the User Experiences thread to help, but there actually has been more positive feedback here from those same users on this thread and also from people other members know but aren't on the site.

      I'll put it this way. Look at how many people are happy about finally getting appointments, myself included.
       
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