Lenire — Bimodal Stimulation Treatment by Neuromod

Discussion in 'Treatments' started by Tinnitus Talk, Apr 20, 2019.

    1. GlennS

      GlennS Member Podcast Patron Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      1992
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud music
      Forgive me for not following this thread religiously but has Neuromod actually done the true "peer review"--of Phase 2? Is this it or some substitute?

      As far as speculation goes, I think Neuromod has leaned heavily on COVID-19 as an excuse and stalling tactic. I think now that COVID-19 is receding in the developing world that the jury will soon be in on it. There is the approval question and its overall reputation. Approval does not necessarily, as we've seen, guarantee either safety or efficacy.
       
    2. Mathew Gould

      Mathew Gould Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      6/2017
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Neck/Jaw misalignment
      Seems like you got your tinnitus the way I did, from neck and jaw issues. Try doing physical therapy on the neck. I got a TMJ splint that knocked down my tinnitus from 4-5 sounds in my head to 1-2 and it took about 3 months after I got it to re-align stuff...

      If that doesn't work, do the Dr. Shore thing.
       
    3. F-u-T

      F-u-T Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      AZ USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trama
      I hope the FDA does approve Lenire. There is always a chance they can improve the device effectiveness after approval. At least they are out there trying to help us.

      Maybe once Dr. Shore completes her trial, she could lease her patented device timings to Neuromod and then we could have an effective device available much sooner.
       
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    4. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Nonnatural energy source
      I like how you are thinking about approval and improvement in Lenire, although I'm still pretty 'meh' on it as a long time user.

      From a completely uninformed perspective I would think that they couldn't directly use Dr. Shore's timings as her device stimulates a different nerve. Additionally, I think the basic concept of Dr. Shore's device is to narrowly target hyperactive areas while I think Lenire conceptually more about a broad stimulation. I suspect her timings aren't transferable.

      "The technique developed by Lim and his colleagues is designed to promote the activation of brain circuits in response to many different sounds to drown out phantom noise. “The idea is that eventually your brain gets sensitive to many different things,” Lim explains. “In a way, you have suppressed the tinnitus neurons but only by elevating the other neurons.” Another group led by Susan Shore, a professor of otolaryngology at the University of Michigan, developed a similar device with a different approach: instead of increasing sensitivity to a broad spectrum of sounds, the team’s method pairs a sound that matches the phantom one heard by patients with a specifically timed electrical pulse to the head or neck."

      New Tinnitus Treatment Alleviates Annoying Ringing in the Ears
       
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    5. F-u-T

      F-u-T Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      AZ USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trama
      I didn’t realize the difference between Lenire and Dr. Shore’s methodology. I thought they were both trying to calm the excited neurons causing tinnitus.

      If Lenire is trying to stimulate additional neurons to essentially drown out the excited neurons causing tinnitus then I can see why they may be having adverse reactions. I never could figure out why the Lenire timings were so different from Dr. Shore’s but now that makes total sense.

      Dr. Shore’s method is based on calming the excited neurons causing tinnitus which I think could have a much more beneficial impact if it really works.

      Lenire is more about habituation whereas Dr. Shore’s is more about calming and reducing the tinnitus. That gives me a lot more hope about Dr. Shore’s method vs the lackluster results we have seen from Lenire.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    6. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Nonnatural energy source
      Yeah, I just ran across that article the other day. I have a Lenire and it sort of explains the soft positive (almost not particularly worth the time) reaction to it. I do seem to do slightly better on it but in a really subtle way. Again more like a habituation than anything else.

      I'm looking forward to the Dr. Shore device but I am slightly concerned that due to the required auditory stimulation she might have trouble treating ultra high pitched tinnitus, because there ain’t much hearing up that high.
       
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    7. Lurius
      Wishful

      Lurius Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      Oslo, Norway
      Tinnitus Since:
      September 2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Valsalva maneuver
      How high would you consider "ultra high pitched" to be? In terms of Hz?
       
    8. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Nonnatural energy source
      I don’t know what others define it as, but mine lives at and above 14 kHz and I consider it ultra high pitched.
       
    9. Chinmoku

      Chinmoku Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Started with a cold, possibly worsened by medication/noise
      Am I the only one who finds this sinister and a little scary? How can it work this way? And is this what Lim was trying in Minnesota?

      I'm a layman but this doesn't sound right.

      Dr. Shore's approach, if not her speed of delivery, looks much more reasonable and encouraging.
       
    10. GBB

      GBB Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      NYC
      Tinnitus Since:
      2016-2019 (Mild, Cured) 8/2020 (Severe)
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Virus / Microsuction / Acoustic Trauma
      I also thought this was screwed up - it's not reversion to normalcy but compensatory, additional deviation.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    11. Gee82

      Gee82 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise
      While using the device, I had the feeling that new connections were forming randomly between neurons, but instead of suppressing my tinnitus they resulted in more tones in my head.

      Most of these tones faded thankfully, but Hubert Lim can go home.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    12. tinmandan

      tinmandan Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      5/12/18
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Head trauma
      Sorry if this has been asked many times before, but I can't seem to find any information about it.

      Do people know when either Lenire or Dr. Shore's device will be available to folks in the US?

      Can US citizens travel for Lenire treatment? Not considering COVID-19 restrictions of course.

      Thanks for any information.
       
    13. Bobb77
      Cynical

      Bobb77 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise drama and stress
      I wrote to my hearing care professional that I would purchase Lenire. I get a special price. I will report to you competently :)
       
    14. Ken219
      Frustrated

      Ken219 Member

      Location:
      New York Area
      Tinnitus Since:
      Summer of 1990
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise exposure?
      I hate junk science!
       
    15. LivingGhost371

      LivingGhost371 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2008
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise Exposure
      Neuromod seems to be neither encouraging nor discouraging U.S. citizens from traveling to them. The potential issue of importing an unapproved medical device into the U.S. has been discussed, but it seems customs and the airport people are more concerned about bombs and cocaine than something that looks like a goofy Walkman.

      The timeline for Dr. Shore seems to be "whenever she feels like it, plus a couple of years".
       
      • Helpful Helpful x 1
    16. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Nonnatural energy source
      I've traveled back and forth all over the place including the USA with Lenire in my carry on, no one had any interest or consideration of it. In fact the customs form that you check off on before entering says nothing about unapproved medical devices. I wouldn't give it a second thought.
       
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    17. PeterPan
      Nerdy

      PeterPan Member Advocate

      Location:
      Sydney
      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2016
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Heat Exhaustion
      I have been working in Canberra recently (about a four hour drive from my place in Sydney). I’ve driven to or from there six times now. On each occasion I have had zero tinnitus the next day (6 out of 6, not a coincidence!). Something seems to be going on related to the sounds when driving and maybe the electrical stimulation when being jostled about in the driver seat...!
       
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    18. UHPTS
      Wishful

      UHPTS Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      October 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear infection
      See, you can start business with this. Driving tinnitus sufferers from Canberra to Sydney and back. Comparing with Lenire, your treatment has already one super responder!
       
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    19. Bobb77
      Cynical

      Bobb77 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise drama and stress
      I may get Lenire next Wednesday. I will keep you updated.
       
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    20. MadsWithT
      No Mood

      MadsWithT Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      Norway
      Tinnitus Since:
      1997
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      See bio
      Lenire is a well-marketed money grabbing scheme, based on shady science. I am surprised you haven’t figured that out, based on your stock market skills. You should study the Lenire User Experiences thread. It is very informative.

      Just out of curiosity, what price did they offer you?
       
    21. Bobb77
      Cynical

      Bobb77 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise drama and stress
      No, Lenire will kill my 8.5/10 tinnitus completely for sure. Hah, I am in the stocks-hyping mode.

      I have a special deal with my hearing care professional, but I'll be silent about it until Wednesday.

      I feel obliged to report back to you about my Lenire experience in the form of a competent test report because the FREQ share gains that have arisen, among other things, from the temporary hype here. That's worth a couple of bucks to me.

      My newest deal: I got into BioNTech very late, but the price earnings ratio is ridiculously cheap. It will become a cash cow soon. Hopefully no one will find out about the side effects I had too...

      upload_2021-5-28_17-4-33.png
       
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    22. DaveFromChicago

      DaveFromChicago Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      01/2014
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Headcold/Flu
      To @Bobb77:

      The tone of your commentary regarding Lenire has the (quite justified) level of disgust that mine had when I reported on Desyncra (and for the same reasons).

      What concerns me is the slight worsening you reported (and even if this cannot be conclusively attributed to Lenire, nonetheless it's obvious purpose is to prevent this).
      Both of these unsubstantiated treatments are grotesquely overpriced (and, even though you will receive a partial refund, will your cost still be approximately $1,100.00?).

      FGG reported that the FDA's bar for approval of such devices if far lower than that for drugs (and she characterized Lenire as "crap"). Still, given the number of similar reports, I find it difficult to believe that this will receive FDA approval in the USA.

      However, thanks ever so much for being an exploratory pioneer so that we can be alerted to it's uselessness.
       
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    23. Dizzyhead888

      Dizzyhead888 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      2015
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      unknown
      I have not followed this thread properly.

      Were there any users reporting any side effects from Lenire, other than worsening of tinnitus? If so, what side effects?
       
    24. Martin69
      Artistic

      Martin69 Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Germany
      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      (Health) Anxiety
      Better to spend your money on BioNTech stocks than on Lenire. Lenire is useless. I can remember ONLY one person on the forums that had an improvement.

      If you can get your money back, do it.

      Best regards (aus Essen),
      Martin
       
      • Agree Agree x 3
    25. Branyan
      Ape-like

      Branyan Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2021
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      C1,C2 Misalignment/TMD
      That pains me to hear. Your story of success with TRT was the last thing I was holding on to.
       
    26. TrevorSanders

      TrevorSanders Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      09/2020
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise Exposure/Ototoxic Medication
      8/10 tinnitus is definitely not maskable by your car and radio. I think you have your scale skewed a bit, unless you’re basing your scale off your own tinnitus.
       
    27. Bobb77
      Cynical

      Bobb77 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Noise drama and stress
      I didn't quite understand your last sentence. I would rate the scale 1-10 as follows:
      • 1 = 5 percent of the day I hear the ringing (if I want to)
      • 10 = 100 percent of the day I hear the ringing
      Whereby levels 1 to 5/10 don't influence me in everyday life.

      I would say my tinnitus was 4/10 from 2010 to 2020. Always audible when I wanted to, I needed podcasts to fall asleep, but I was always able to sleep through the night and sometimes sleep for 10 to 11 hours at a time.

      At 6/10 to 10/10 it is audible for more than 50 percent of the day.
       
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    28. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      April 16 2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Nonnatural energy source
      Thanks, I thought I was having an ok tinnitus day, but now I realize that I have a 10/10 day. :)
       
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    29. F-u-T

      F-u-T Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      AZ USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Acoustic Trama
      On that scale I pretty much always have 10/10 tinnitus. Can’t really mask it with any noise level that doesn’t hurt due to my hyperacusis.

      At least I have no trouble sleeping as I am always exhausted due to my sleep apnea.
       
    30. Padraigh Griffin

      Padraigh Griffin Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      05/2020
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown/Stress
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