Tinnitus and Hyperacusis Have Worsened AGAIN (After Spending an Hour at a 90 dB Restaurant)

[dpdx]

Tinnitus and hyperacusis have worsened again. As you all know I got a second acoustic trauma which resulted in inner hair cell damage by the two ear tests CVEMP and Caloric Test.

The hearing exam (most recent) revealed mild hearing loss in noisy areas in both ears, audiogram showed dips on 3 kHz and 6 kHz.

Two weeks ago or so I was at a loud restaurant around 90 dB for about 1 hour. The next day I noticed tinnitus was louder than it was and my hyperacusis has gotten worse.

To make things worse my 6/10 of tinnitus days have disappeared and I am back to having 8/10 tinnitus days with moderate hyperacusis. My voice and the voice of others, objects clanking, etc brings discomfort to my ears.

 

[Tinker Bell]

The restaurant was 90dB? That would surpass OSHA guidelines for the staff. Did you share your decibel reader findings with the management?

 

[GregCA]

I personally would have bailed from a 1+hour period in 90 dB environment. In fact, I did last year at Disney On Ice.
Did you feel comfortable enough in that environment to stay?

 

[Deamon22]

@dpdx Did you wear foam earplugs?

 

[Tinker Bell]

I personally would have bailed from a 1+hour period in 90 dB environment. In fact, I did last year at Disney On Ice.
Did you feel comfortable enough in that environment to stay?

If an environment registers 90dB, I do not stay around either. That would be incredibly uncomfortable in a restaurant, the staff and patrons would have to shout to be heard.

Was it genuinely 90dB or @dpdx did you assume it was that loud? I realized early on that hyperacusis made me a terrible judge of sound volumes. I would think it was 90dB, only to check a reliable decibel reading app and realize it was only 75dB.

 

[coffee_girl]

I heard those db meters on your phone are often incorrect or grossly exaggerated? Does anyone know?

 

[Red]

I heard those db meters on your phone are often incorrect or grossly exaggerated? Does anyone know?

This is debated all the time. Or at least it was when I first joined. I believe a user linked an article that phones are competent measuring devices.

Personally I don't see how they could be. There are so many variations of mics out there and they are not all created equal. You're really going to tell me the mic of a phone will be equivalent to a sound meter that was made specifically for measuring environmental sound as opposed to talking on the phone?

 

[Michael Leigh]

I heard those db meters on your phone are often incorrect or grossly exaggerated? Does anyone know?

I know one thing. The best place for decibel meters is in the rubbish bin. They promote negative thinking and reinforce the belief that the person using them has a problem with intolerance to sound. I have used a decibel meter and also a decibel App on my phone, purely for experimental purposes when writing my post: Hypercusis, As I see it. I tolerated sound levels of 100db without any problems.

Once you stop using decibel meters, earplugs, earmuffs unnecessarily. Stress, anxiety fear and paranoia, will begin to subside and a person will start to feel much better about themselves, tinnitus and life. Guaranteed.

Michael

 

[Jack Straw]

@dpdx

90 dB in a restaurant? That's crazy loud. Did you wear ear plugs?

 

[Tinker Bell]

This is debated all the time. Or at least it was when I first joined. I believe a user linked an article that phones are competent measuring devices.

Personally I don't see how they could be. There are so many variations of mics out there and they are not all created equal. You're really going to tell me the mic of a phone will be equivalent to a sound meter that was made specifically for measuring environmental sound as opposed to talking on the phone?

I believe the study found that iPhone mics were determined to be competent, other brands were not.

 

[Jack Straw]

I heard those db meters on your phone are often incorrect or grossly exaggerated? Does anyone know?

This is debated all the time. Or at least it was when I first joined. I believe a user linked an article that phones are competent measuring devices.

Personally I don't see how they could be. There are so many variations of mics out there and they are not all created equal. You're really going to tell me the mic of a phone will be equivalent to a sound meter that was made specifically for measuring environmental sound as opposed to talking on the phone?

I have a decibel meter reader on my phone and a separate one I purchased on Amazon. The ones on our phones are quiet good and are usually within 3-5 Db (higher) of the legit meter. It also depends on if you are measure using A, B, C or Z. Between A and Z there is always a 10 Db increase. I am not sure why or what the difference is.

Overall our phones do a good job at estimating within 3-5 dB, but aren't exact.

 

[Tinker Bell]

My decibel app did not promote negative thinking nor reinforce sound intolerance. Quite the opposite in fact. More often than not, it reassured me that my sound environment was safe. It helped me recognize that environments were often no where near as loud as I perceived.

Realizing that a venue was actually 15 times quieter than I thought, well that helped me to relax and enjoy myself.

 

[Jazzer]

I know one thing. The best place for decibel meters is in the rubbish bin. They promote negative thinking and reinforce the belief that the person using them has a problem with intolerance to sound. I have used a decibel meter and also a decibel App on my phone, purely for experimental purposes when writing my post: Hypercusis, As I see it. I tolerated sound levels of 100db without any problems.

Once you stop using decibel meters, earplugs, earmuffs unnecessarily. Stress, anxiety fear and paranoia, will begin to subside and a person will start to feel much better about themselves, tinnitus and life. Guaranteed.

Michael

Unusually Michael,
I disagree completely.
We need to teach ourselves to be aware of dangerous volume levels.

 

[Michael Leigh]

We need to teach ourselves to be aware of dangerous volume levels.

Absolutely not @Jazzer and with respect I disagree with you wholeheartedly. I counsel and correspond with many people that have tinnitus and hyperacusis. The number one problems that keep fear, anxiety and panic alive with these conditions are: overuse of earplugs, earmuffs and decibel meters. I receive emails, PMs from people in utter fear of venturing outside their front door because everyday normal sounds will make their tinnitus and hyperacusis worse. Utter rubbish! I feel terribly sorry for these people.

One person who is an advocate of wearing earmuffs, earplugs of every description in this forum (whom we all know) is even afraid of the sound of a public WC system been flushed or the sound of a hand dryer. Two people in this forum, have developed: Phonophobia and Misophonia in addition to their tinnitus and hyperacusis following this person's ridiculous and totally erroneous advice.

Michael

 

[coffee_girl]

I guess I'll be one of those people buying a db meter just to test it out. Never used one before.

 

[JohnAdams]

They promote negative thinking and reinforce the belief that the person using them has a problem with intolerance to sound.

Say what?

 

[JohnAdams]

Unusually Michael,
I disagree completely.
We need to teach ourselves to be aware of dangerous volume levels.

Is this man really trying to say we shouldnt avoid loud sounds with our damaged ears? I learned the hard way that loud noises can spike my tinnitus for days. Am I just a living in fear because I dont want spikes? If he is saying what i think he is then he is a very dangerous person and is going to lead someone to really hurt themselves and screw their lives up worse than they are.

 

[GregCA]

Personally I don't see how they could be. There are so many variations of mics out there and they are not all created equal.

There aren't that many variations across iPhones for example. That's one of the platforms that you can build an app for, calibrate it with a real sound meter next to it, and be fairly confident that other people who bought the same phone will have the same results.

You're really going to tell me the mic of a phone will be equivalent to a sound meter that was made specifically for measuring environmental sound as opposed to talking on the phone?

It has its own limitations of course, but if you're willing to admit an error margin of a few dB, they can be "good enough" for a rough estimate. I consider it "good enough for me", but that's because I don't sweat the dBs: I can tell if some setting makes me uncomfortable or not, and I don't really care what the measurement app tells me, as it won't override my judgement.

 

[Michael Leigh]

I guess I'll be one of those people buying a db meter just to test it out. Never used one before.

@coffee_girl

You are quite sensible and I'm sure that you won't get caught up in the panic, fear and anxiety that some people do about sound. By all means buy a dedicated sound level meter. You will soon find it's quite pointless for you have habituated. I doubt sound levels in excess of 80db -100db will bother you.

Michael

 

[coffee_girl]

Is this man really trying to say we shouldnt avoid loud sounds with our damaged ears? I learned the hard way that loud noises can spike my tinnitus for days. Am I just a living in fear because I dont want spikes? If he is saying what i think he is then he is a very dangerous person and is going to lead someone to really hurt themselves and screw their lives up worse than they are.

Maybe he just means that people who are already overly paranoid will just be reinforced in their paranoia when they see those numbers? Usually paranoid people are already over protective of their ears and don't need more reasons to be fanatical about it? That's what I got from michaels post

 

[JohnAdams]

Maybe he just means that people who are already overly paranoid will just be reinforced in their paranoia when they see those numbers? Usually paranoid people are already over protective of their ears and don't need more reasons to be fanatical about it? That's what I got from michaels post

Better safe than sorry right?

 

[coffee_girl]

@coffee_girl

I doubt sound levels in excess of 80db -100db will bother you.

Michael

Thanks Michael, though I wonder just because it doesn't bother me and don't lead to spikes... If I am secretly creating damage to my ears that I am unaware of. I normally am not paranoid over sound but my puppy has recently started barking to let me know she need to go outside... And often times she is sitting right next to me. It's the only reason I am getting a dB app on my phone (to gage her bark).

 

[Michael Leigh]

Thanks Michael, though I wonder just because it doesn't bother me and don't lead to spikes... If I am secretly creating damage to my ears that I am unaware of. I normally am not paranoid over sound but my puppy has recently started barking to let me know she need to go outside... And often times she is sitting right next to me. It's the only reason I am getting a dB app on my phone (to gage her bark).

The barking of your dog will not damage your ears. It is the belief that it might which is of concern. Belief can kill and it can cure. Tinnitus is 90% mental in the way we deal with it and how it affects our mental and emotional wellbeing. Once negativity is reinforced about a certain thing to do with tinniitus. It can be: Intolerance to certain sounds, disbelief that a treatment won't work etc - these thoughts become very real and difficult for a person to change.

It is for this reason, I advise anyone that is in the habituation process or having a particular treatment for their tinnitus: TRT, CBT etc, to keep away from tinnitus forums and negative thinking people. Their negative beliefs can seriously affect a person's progress on the habitution path.

Michael

 

[Jazzer]

Absolutely not @Jazzer and with respect I disagree with you wholeheartedly. I counsel and correspond with many people that have tinnitus and hyperacusis. The number one problems that keep fear, anxiety and panic alive with these conditions are: overuse of earplugs, earmuffs and decibel meters. I receive emails, PMs from people in utter fear of venturing outside their front door because everyday normal sounds will make their tinnitus and hyperacusis worse. Utter rubbish! I feel terribly sorry for these people.

One person who is an advocate of wearing earmuffs, earplugs of every description in this forum (whom we all know) is even afraid of the sound of a public WC system been flushed or the sound of a hand dryer. Two people in this forum, have developed: Phonophobia and Misophonia in addition to their tinnitus and hyperacusis following this person's ridiculous and totally erroneous advice.

Michael

Everybody's physiological make is different.
Our levels of damage are different.
Certain noises cause me actual physical pain.
One of those noises is that given out by ludicrously loud hand dryers.
Also vicious food blenders.

I will respond directly, and protect from those conditions that cause me actual physical pain, rather than listen to the advice of anybody, however well meaning.
It would be as well to remember that there are far more unknowns when it comes to hearing damage, than there are knowns.
Generalisations are inherently dangerous.
You only have your own experiences to go on regarding discomfort and pain.
Your ears are not my ears.

In this regard I will take my own council.

 

[Michael Leigh]

Well said @Jazzer and nicely written as usual.

Just remember. It is your tinnitus and hyperacusis that are the route cause of your problem. If they are not treated or you do not respond to treatment. The intolerance to sound that you describe will be forever present.

I wish you well
Michael

 

[Red]

Is this man really trying to say we shouldnt avoid loud sounds with our damaged ears? I learned the hard way that loud noises can spike my tinnitus for days. Am I just a living in fear because I dont want spikes? If he is saying what i think he is then he is a very dangerous person and is going to lead someone to really hurt themselves and screw their lives up worse than they are.

No, I don't think so at all. Michael is among the first to talk about avoidance of loud places and that double protection won't be enough. There is sound that hurts us and then there is sound that just gives us anxiety.

 

[Jazzer]

It is your tinnitus and hyperacusis that are the route cause of your problem. If they are not treated

I found these statements very interesting.
There are no effective treatments for either Tinnitus or hyperacusis, other then psychological adjustments.
(ie. TRT and CBT.)

I had Tinnitus for over 20 years that caused me no problem whatsoever.
It was an incident of unprotected aggressive noise that ramped things up tremendously.
According to your theories, that additional noise should have made absolutely no difference.

I should add that I have found many of your posts to be very informative and helpful.
However, on the subject of the necessity or otherwise, for further ear protection, I could not disagree with you more than I do.

My own degree of discomfort / pain, allied to my good common sense, will be my guiding light.

 

[Jazzer]

Better safe than sorry right?

Spot on my man.
Just take care x

 

[Elfin]

One of those noises is that given out by ludicrously loud hand dryers.
Also vicious food blenders.

There's a childrens' book in here, @Jazzer
I can see the illustrations of the vicious food blenders already, with their sharp silvery teeth and menacing glint of eye...

I agree with you; there are some noises which cause pain. Service station hand dryers for example. I will avoid these whenever possible

 

[Jazzer]

There's a childrens' book in here, @Jazzer
I can see the illustrations of the vicious food blenders already, with their sharp silvery teeth and menacing glint of eye...

I agree with you; there are some noises which cause pain. Service station hand dryers for example. I will avoid these whenever possible

Have the ear plugs in your pocket ready Elfin.
Be your own judge of potential damage
my friend x