Neuromonics

Discussion in 'Treatments' started by Markku, Mar 29, 2013.

    1. Micky
      Dancing

      Micky Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      10 / 2000
      Lisa wrote...
      Lisa .. Yes it was the Sanctuary unit.. But was custom tailored to my hearing loss and tinnitus volume.. I did have some therapy.. But to be honest the counciling often made me feel worse.. The Oasis is virtually the same but more streamlined and a nicer looking unit.. As far as i know the same 4 tracks playing over and over again are all ya get.. As far as the councilling goes and my take on it .. That is just my perspective.. IM not sure why it made me feel worse.. Guess i didn't like talking about it.. I still have my sanctuary unit but its seen better days as i wore the thing out .. I wouldn't use it again though even if it were repairable.. My advice for what its worth is to buy yourself a good quality mp3 player then download some digitally enhanced tinnitus masking sounds like running water.. Bird songs.. Ocean sounds of the sea.. Rain falling.. Save yourself 5000 .. Good luck Lisa whatever you decide... Micky
       
    2. Lisa88

      Lisa88 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      Hi Mickey, I was told the Sanctuary has 4 presents, and if the patient falls within one of those presets, great. That is the one they choose for hm/her. If you have one tone only and mild to moderate hearing loss, you may have fallen pretty close in one of those. Plus the Oasis is set to a two phase process. First phase with the embedded signal, second phase with the embedded signal dulled out (they reset the device). I have multi tones going on. Not sure I am going to qualify for the success rate they have been seeing with the Oasis. Plus two of my tones compete with white noise. Grrrr. Sorry it didn't work for you, Micky. Sounds you would have been a great candidate according to that above study link. Thanks for all the info.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    3. Piper the great
      Amused

      Piper the great Member

      Location:
      Grand Prairie, Texas
      Tinnitus Since:
      8/2012
      It seemed to be multi tones/sounds.. first loud RING, and two hisses that seemed to have their own pattern.. of up and down.. but now just a lower level ring....I used the Oasis....
       
      • Like Like x 1
    4. Dr. Nagler

      Dr. Nagler Member

      Location:
      Atlanta, Georgia USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/1994
      Folks with Lyme Disease and certain other CNS disorders can have a more difficult time of it, but to the best of my knowledge stroke victims who have recovered (or largely recovered) from their deficits seem to do fine for the most part.

      My overall impression regarding barriers to habituation in general have to do with a lack of understanding of the process and - especially where Neuromonics is concerned - inadequate counseling.

      Hope this helps more than confuses.

      Stephen Nagler
       
      • Like Like x 1
    5. DebInAustralia
      Fine

      DebInAustralia Member Benefactor Advocate

      Location:
      Geelong, Victoria
      Tinnitus Since:
      30/12/13
      can someone please explain the difference between neuromonics and audionotch?
       
    6. LadyDi
      Busy

      LadyDi Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Florida, USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Barotrauma/airplane
      I appreciate your response, thanks. Am just more curious than anything. I don't want to get all caught up in chasing down if the stroke is an issue, given it won't make any difference in how to approach the problem. It's like getting fixated on what caused your tinnitus, if there is no obvious answer.

      And I agree regarding Neuromonics and counseling. But I do think the counseling in my program is fine. Just think am impatient.
       
    7. Mark McDill
      Curious

      Mark McDill Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Papillion, NE
      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Likely stress, anxiety, an antibiotic and nsaids
      LadyDi
      Sounds like you are on a good track; wished I had made some of these smart moves (seeing aud at onset) when my T came on last year.

      I don't have any experience with the devices you are talking about; however, I do have the Starky/Audibell brand hearing aids from Nebraska Hearing Instruments (Omaha, NE) with white noise generators (they are programmable to target/mask my specific T). They are awesome; I would not have done nearly as well without them (life savers).

      I agree with all on this site -- habituation is the end goal (that's the win); what path you take to get there is a very individual choice; Nebraska Hearing Instruments and Starky/Audibell got me there (whew).

      Hope this helps.

      Mark
       
    8. DebInAustralia
      Fine

      DebInAustralia Member Benefactor Advocate

      Location:
      Geelong, Victoria
      Tinnitus Since:
      30/12/13
      Do you mind me asking who your audiologist is? i am considering seeing a different one..thanks
       
    9. Piper the great
      Amused

      Piper the great Member

      Location:
      Grand Prairie, Texas
      Tinnitus Since:
      8/2012
      I paid the money and did the treatment, its not only the device you pay for but the audiologist time and time in the booth.. the device is 3500 dollars anything else goes to the clinic. I got benefit out of it, I tried other sound devices and didn't like it. I think it speeds habituation... the sound is based on your hearing loss. It sounds like a lot of money, but when your willing to blew your pumpkin off, its really cheap... or that is the way I feel.. but everyone has to deal with their T. I think T is similar, but different in everyone. It got me through a tough time, and I have no regrets. I think you can achieve the same results with an MP# player, I would choose classical music. My 2 cents...:)
       
    10. Grace
      No Mood

      Grace Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/14/2013
      Neuromoics kinda reminds me like when ive been on the internet and am reading an article or just something really interesting and im so into it and have music playin on my itunes.. I remember goin through 5 or 6 songs not even hearing them cause i was sooo focused on reading.. And i would go back to the songs i missed ( or just wasnt paying attention so i didnt hear it) and replayed them. So i guess i proved to myself that i
      Am able to ignor sounds without even noticing it and even fairly loud music! So i would deff try this if my t ever got real bad that i needed help to habuitate .
       
    11. LadyDi
      Busy

      LadyDi Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Florida, USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Barotrauma/airplane

      Hey @Mark McDill, how are you?

      I did strongly consider the Widex hearing aid/masker along with the Neuromonics, which sounds fairly similar to what you are using. In fact, one audiologist said she thought the Widex was a better choice for me. I do well with masking sounds, plus they are wireless and fit into your ear. Dealing with the Neuromonics device and headset is kind of a pain.

      But I though I would habituate faster with Neuromonics, vs. straight masking. We will see. If ultimately Neuromonics doesn't give me the results I want, I would be interested in what you are using. However, I have only very slight hearing loss, at very high frequencies, so I don't need a hearing aid per se. Is that true for you, too?

      BTW: I saw you are/were stationed at Offutt AFB, and are/were with the SAC. I spent five years of my childhood in the Omaha suburb of Prairie Lane, very near Offutt. Remember watching the SAC fighters going overhead, and a few times hearing them break the sound barrier.
       
    12. Mark McDill
      Curious

      Mark McDill Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Papillion, NE
      Tinnitus Since:
      03/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Likely stress, anxiety, an antibiotic and nsaids

      LadyDi
      Sorry I haven't answered back, I had to go to DC for a few days

      You know, the more I learn from this site and from the wise-heads in the T world, the more I'm inclined to agree with you. T is such an individual thing (can't think of anything more subjective) and at the end of the day it is all about habituation; I would go the route that gets you there best (regarding comfort and cost).

      I was such a wreck after four weeks of T that I did a 'crazed' Google search and basically stumbled onto these things. I was very ignorant about T (except the part where they say there's no cure) and, furthermore I was ignorant about these kinds of devices. Fortunately, they have worked very well for me (so I personally think they are great). I specifically liked the fact I could adjust the white noise until my specific T was masked; but I also like that I can program four different channels for various situations/environments.

      I do have moderate/significant hearing loss in my left ear (in the high pitched range -- that's where my T lives); so, I'm going with the hearing aids. My audiologist says I need to keep that range energized/excited.

      Yup, still here at Offutt AFB; it's funny cause I used to be a 'SAC trained killer' stationed in Ft. Worth, Oklahoma, and Missouri back in the 80s/90s and now I walk down the halls at work and I still see old SAC
      paraphernalia here and there (some things never die). We live in Papillion now (Lake Wood Villages to be specific)

      Mark
       
    13. Lisa88

      Lisa88 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      Still considering Neuromonics. My most annoying t is at around 160hz. But the broadband noise apparently only goes down to 250hz. Well, I get different reports about that depending on who I talk to.
      Lady Di and Piper, do you know the name of that first classical song they have on there? I have heard it a couple of times now in office. Cheers.
       
    14. LadyDi
      Busy

      LadyDi Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Florida, USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Barotrauma/airplane
      Wow, @Lisa88, that is a low-pitched T. I am way at the other end. Not sure about the broadband range, but an audiologist certified by Neuromonics should be able to tell you.

      And I don't know the exact name of the tune you are referencing. But funny... there is a piece about three-quarters of the way through the two classical tracks that I love (its primarily violin and oboe). I have been wanting to ask my audiologist if she knows the name of it.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    15. Lisa88

      Lisa88 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      Hi @LadyDi. Yes, the range of my most annoying frequency starts that low. I phoned Australia's Neuromonics main guy. He said the audiologists can only input as low as 250hz. But then an audiologist says it goes down to 125hz. As I understand it, the broadband noise is supposed to cater to 1. your specific hearing loss and 2. your t frequency. Feel a bit skeptical doing it if it doesn't even cover my most annoying frequency. I have about 5 frequencies altogether, but the most annoying one is low. May just get the Sanctuary device and take it to the UK with me, then get separate counseling over in the UK at the London Tinnitus Clinic. Only thing is, they then can't implement the phase 2 on that device, i.e. taking out the broadband/white noise embedded signal. I do think Neuromonics is a good fit for me in terms of masking my t with music. At the moment, 3.5 months in, I am constantly monitoring it and disturbed by it. Like you, I would feel I am doing something positive in at least distracting me from my t.
       
    16. Lisa88

      Lisa88 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      p.s. It should go below 250hz, as that is really not that low - Around middle C on a keyboard.
       
    17. Lisa88

      Lisa88 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      @Markku , Thanks for this post. Do you know how long after onset Jim started his Neuromonics treatment? I am thinking the sooner the better re plastic changes in the brain. Cheers Markku! Lisa
       
    18. AUTHOR
      AUTHOR
      Markku
      Inspired

      Markku Founder Staff Podcast Patron Benefactor Hall of Fame Advocate

      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Syringing
      He started his Neuromonics treatment in January 2010, and he had had tinnitus since April 2007.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    19. demi
      No Mood

      demi Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2012
      notice.png
      Read Dr. Nagler's review of Neuromonics vs TRT here ≫.

      transparent_divider_II.png

      What is the difference?

      Since my H seems to be worsening and T becoming for disruptive, I have decided to get some formal help. The thing is the TRT specialist here has a waiting list because she is going through her own health problems...but I was referred by her office to another women here who does Neuromonics. I just was wondering what is the real difference?
       
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    20. demi
      No Mood

      demi Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2012
      anyone?
       
    21. Grace
      No Mood

      Grace Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/14/2013
      Im gonna guess that trt has the same basic concept of neuromonics meaning a person is going to face to face help you to habuitate to your T and prob even talk about your worries and how to get over it where neuromonics is just a mp3 player that you listen to for some hours in the day and it trains your brain that way but i would go for trt cause you can actually talk to someone about your T and idk id feel alot better being able to talk to someone rather then spending money on neuromonics that you could probably just make your own version of it for cheaper.
       
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    22. WestCoastGirl85
      Buzzed

      WestCoastGirl85 Member

      Location:
      California
      Tinnitus Since:
      September 2011
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ototoxic ear drops getting into inner ear canal
      I have a video about neuromonics on my youtube channel. search mylifewithtinnitus i hope it helps
       
    23. Lisa88

      Lisa88 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      @WestCoastGirl85 , did it help you? Just watched your videos, and the update did not tell us if it actually was helping. Cheers.
       
      • Agree Agree x 1
    24. jazz
      No Mood

      jazz Member Benefactor

      Location:
      US
      Tinnitus Since:
      8/2012
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      eardrum rupture from virus; barotrauma from ETD
      @demi Hello!

      They are probably both equally effective if you have a good practitioner. There was a recent study conducted by the Cleveland Clinic that compared in-ear sound generators (such as those used in TRT therapy) with Neuromonics. Here is a link to a discussion on TT:

      https://www.tinnitustalk.com/threads/neuromonics.1378/ See note #4 by Markku on the study.

      Both use a type of sound therapy, but they are very different. TRT uses white noise; Neuromonics uses spectrally modified music. TRT also requires you to wear the noise generators all the time; this is to help your brain learn to ignore your tinnitus signal. Neuromonics requires you to listen to music for several hours a day. Neuromonics also has several different devices, based on your particular needs. The original version is called Oasis; but they now also have a Sanctuary and Haven device. Here's a company link:

      http://neuromonics.com/

      Both TRT and Neuromonics--as well as other therapies--focus primarily on your reaction to your tinnitus. As that reaction changes from annoyance to disinterest, your noise level should be reduced or sometimes eliminated (unless you purposely look for it). Of course, there's no guarantee how much your noise will be reduced; that's why its important to find someone who is skilled in whatever therapy you use. Please also know it takes quite a while (depending on the therapy) for your brain to learn to ignore your tinnitus. Plan on devoting six months to a year or more.

      I believe @LadyDi is also currently using Neuromonics so you might question her. And Dr. Nagler is an expert in TRT. Other therapies that help with tinnitus and hyperacusis include CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy) and mindfulness. Of the two, I prefer CBT since it has several clinical studies that attest to the therapy's effectiveness for tinnitus annoyance.

      And here are two articles on Neuromonics from an audiologist's perspective that you might find interesting:

      http://www.audiologyonline.com/articles/clinician-s-perspective-neuromonics-tinnitus-11555

      http://www.audiologyonline.com/ask-the-experts/what-advantages-neuromonics-tinnitus-treatment-11646
       
      • Winner Winner x 1
    25. Dr. Nagler

      Dr. Nagler Member

      Location:
      Atlanta, Georgia USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/1994
      Neuromonics v TRT ...

      Will respond on the Doctors' Corner in a few days. See "PREPARING AN ANSWER" at Forums > Support > Doctors' Corner > Dr. Stephen Nagler.

      Stephen Nagler
       
    26. Grace
      No Mood

      Grace Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/14/2013
      this has been mentions prob tons on here but about how much is TRT? I have prob one of the best insurance policies out there so was wondering if it would cover it. Not looking to do trt as of now cause my T is real mild and doesnt bother me but for some reason in a few years it spikes i would deff want to do trt.
       
    27. Dr. Nagler

      Dr. Nagler Member

      Location:
      Atlanta, Georgia USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/1994
      Costs vary from clinician to clinician. Average all-encompassing cost to patient for Neuromonics including evaluation, device, counseling, and follow-up is roughly $5500-$6000. For TRT it is roughly $3800-$4100. If cost is a factor for you, best bet would be to ask the clinician who will be administering the treatment in question. And so you can be comparing apples to apples, my advice would be to be sure to ask for an all-encompassing cost for the entire treatment program.

      Regarding insurance coverage, insurance is a business - and any benefit to you, the consumer, from your interaction with an insurance company, no matter how "good" your policy might be, is strictly a coincidental byproduct of that company's true mission, which is its profit and loss statement. Please do not for one moment fool yourself into thinking otherwise. So even the "best" policies typically do not cover tinnitus - because they can get away with it!

      Stephen Nagler
       
    28. Micky
      Dancing

      Micky Member

      Location:
      London
      Tinnitus Since:
      10 / 2000
      So that's TRT. @ 4000 Bucks
      and Neuromonics @6000 Bucks
      ... What an insult to a desperate suffer esp as at the end of both courses the patient will Still have damn Tinnitus..
       
    29. demi
      No Mood

      demi Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/2012
      Why is there such a price difference?
       
    30. Dr. Nagler

      Dr. Nagler Member

      Location:
      Atlanta, Georgia USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/1994
      Interesting philosophy.

      It seems to me that the real insult would be to not give credit to the patient for having the intelligence to understand that having tinnitus but not suffering is far better than having tinnitus and suffering.

      Stephen Nagler
       

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