Elon Musk’s Neuralink Looking to Treat Tinnitus

Discussion in 'Research News' started by Jack Straw, Jul 17, 2019.

    1. ThomasF
      Creative

      ThomasF Member

      Location:
      Florida
      Tinnitus Since:
      2001
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Probably loud music
      The brain argument is a strange one.

      Phantom pain, just from a quick google, comes from the spinal cord and brain. So in terms of tackling the pain itself, targeting those components makes logical sense.

      However, say with a lost hand, the transplanting of a hand seems to have resulted in alleviation of phantom pain and in some cases the complete ridding of it. In essence this makes the argument that, if the tissue is replaced/repaired and assuming tinnitus plays by similar rules to phantom pain, the phantom noise could be at least reduced if not removed entirely.

      Nerve stuff is weird and I am no doctor of course, but a lot of these pieces fit.
       
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    2. in_LA

      in_LA Member

      Location:
      Los Angeles
      Tinnitus Since:
      2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud music
      At the moment I remain cautiously optimistic on anything that comes from Musk's businesses. I wish he would put out as much time on Neuralink as he does on Twitter.
       
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    3. Damocles
      No Mood

      Damocles Member Podcast Patron Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      England
      Tinnitus Since:
      2009
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otitis media
      Yeah, it would've been ironic, if my response to @Tasty were supposed to have been an analogy or a comparison, because @chinup's is so flawed itself. But it wasn't and my post actually bore no relation to tinnitus beyond debunking an asserted definitive that is all too often coupled with it's mention.

      There was no opinion on cause or treatment, just the demonstration of the certainty: that physical damage to any part of the body (not just the ears) is processed in the brain, therefore it is unreasonable to say tinnitus (solely) is beyond doubt, an issue isolated to the brain (and if anyone disagrees with that, then let's start calling arthritis a "brain problem" too, shall we?).

      Yet, several members here seem to think my post was attempting to draw an exact parallel with tinnitus. That the hand was supposed to be an ear, and the knife a 200 dB sonic boom or some sh*t. When all it was, was the most obvious way I could think of to illustrate how all pain could be called a "brain problem" in clown world.

      I mean, I even clarified the intention of my post after the captain misinterpreted it the first time:

      lit.PNG

      It's almost like... people don't fully read the thread or its posts before rating or responding...

      tYTNlMi1jZWY2ZThhZWFiYzUvZDdhbTlsaS0zYjliMTBhYi02NWZlLTQyYTgtOGIwOC00YzMxM2ZkYTRiNzEucG5nIn1dXX0.png
       
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    4. chinup

      chinup Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      2010
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud music
      Ah yes, it’s our fault that you didn’t foresee the logical interpretation of your not-really-about-tinnitus meme in the tinnitus forum. Thank goodness we have the treatise you’ve written explaining what you actually meant.
      You write like a 17-year-old who has just decided to major in philosophy after taking mushrooms. No one should be put through torture of “fully reading” it. Pull your head out of your ass and communicate like someone who respects the other people in this forum and maybe you’ll be better understood. Cheers.
       
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    5. Damocles
      No Mood

      Damocles Member Podcast Patron Benefactor Hall of Fame

      Location:
      England
      Tinnitus Since:
      2009
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Otitis media
      Your interpretation = the "logical" interpretation.

      Of course.

      In 1988 John Carpenter wrote a film named They Live about the dangers of capitalism.

      30 years later the film is interpreted by a couple thousand people, as a prophetic warning about a secret society like the "illuminati", or actual aliens, controlling the global population.

      Carpenter has himself come out and stated this is an outright nonsense.

      But I suppose the latter was the "logical interpretation", despite what the author of the work says.

      Personally, I think the "logical" interpretation -whether it be a cinematic masterpiece or an amateurishly composed "meme" exposing a poor scientific theory- is to look at something like it's context, given: the time it was written in (i.e. Reagan's presidency), or perhaps just reading the text it's responding to (i.e. a post stating any issue processed in the brain can only be treated in the brain).

      Listen, I once misinterpreted an excerpt from a book by Herbert Ernest Bates in an English exam. I get how you're feeling; you're upset. But I didn't write a bitter and sarcastic message to the exam board, or the long time dead Herbert Ernest Bates for that matter. I accepted the lost mark and moved on (trying my best with with the creative writing paper), and you should too.
      17 year old on mushrooms, huh? That stings. But it's funny maturity should come up here, because there's no way you (or @JackSparrow) could possibly have confirmed the meaning of my post before shooting it down, was there?

      No. I guess that doesn't provide quite the same adrenaline rush as "cleverly" upstaging a randomer on a support forum.
      Then keep half-reading people's posts and incorrectly contradicting them. It's no skin off my nose, because I have no intention of ever interacting with you again. But as for your future relations on the forum, I'm sure this behaviour will make you very popular.
      I respect many people on this forum. One thing all of them have in common, is that they're not gunning for this award▼ with posts like yours.

      raw.gif

      You have my sincerest apologies for depriving you of it on this occasion (your "witty" retort being so wide of the mark). But seeing as it means so much to you, you have my best wishes for your future endeavours in one-upmanship.
       
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    6. ThomasF
      Creative

      ThomasF Member

      Location:
      Florida
      Tinnitus Since:
      2001
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Probably loud music
      I wonder if Neuralink could improve certain eye issues. My mother had a stroke years back that made her vision worse. She isn't blind and thank God she is doing very well.

      However, her eyesight was affected and it isn't the eyes themselves, more so the optic nerve that was damaged.
       
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    7. Sam Marksmen
      Confused

      Sam Marksmen Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2021
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Meds
      Neuralink is what's going to make people walk someday.

      If damaged hair cells cause excess Glutamate and the NMDA receptors can't eat them all up, you have neurotoxicity and that kills auditory nerve cells I think. Then your brain doesn't have that stimuli so it makes up its own.

      I could be wrong about all this. But at that junction if you introduced a new stimuli electronically, you might cancel out the tinnitus. Out of any of the cures or treatments this by far makes the most sense.

      The problem is it's like all of Elon's stuff, ultra expensive and for a select few.
       
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    8. danielthor

      danielthor Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Denmark
      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2020
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Unknown
      I was just now thinking about this. Is Neuralink even worth holding out hope for? Considering it’s probably not something an ordinary person could ever afford.

      Edit:

      There’s this:

      D582A647-C6C5-425B-8585-59DD2529FA42.jpeg

      But not sure how believable this is.
       
      • Informative Informative x 1
    9. AfroSnowman
      Balanced

      AfroSnowman Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2019
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Nonnatural energy source
      Folks go 10s of thousands in medical debt all the time to get treatments. If it works, I’d rather drive an old POS car for the rest of my life than live with tinnitus. Sign me up for crippling debt if it works.
       
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    10. Sam Marksmen
      Confused

      Sam Marksmen Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2021
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Meds
      A few thousand dollars, hell ten, I'll be in debt, plus once they do it, they can't repossess it.
       
    11. SmallRonnie
      Ape-like

      SmallRonnie Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      Ireland
      Tinnitus Since:
      H since 2018. T since 2021
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud noise
      Health is priceless. Plus, my condition is so bad, if it were better, I would be able to actually work too and make more money anyway.

      Seeing all the Teslas go on fire though doesn't give me massive faith in this lol.
       
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    12. BrOKeN_1

      BrOKeN_1 Member Hall of Fame

      Tinnitus Since:
      10/2020
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      High Frequency Hearing Loss
      Control. Alt. Delete. Lol.
       
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    13. ThomasF
      Creative

      ThomasF Member

      Location:
      Florida
      Tinnitus Since:
      2001
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Probably loud music
      I'd live as a hermit in the woods subsisting on berries and squirrels if it meant a life without tinnitus. The demand is real.
       
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    14. Sam Marksmen
      Confused

      Sam Marksmen Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      06/2021
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Meds
      I almost laughed but I'm in so much pain. You got me close however, thank you.
       
      • Hug Hug x 2
    15. Lins12

      Lins12 Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      07/2022
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear Wax / Infection
      • Informative Informative x 1
    16. KoolKat
      Dreaming

      KoolKat Member

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Headphone Noise induced ( BEING STUPID)
      Is there any way they could kick Elon Musk out the group and replace him with a more honorable billionaire with integrity?
       
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    17. Hottopic29

      Hottopic29 Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Niagara falls
      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Zithromycin acoustic trauma 2022
      There was a study on brain stimulation. Patients only got little relief and had to still use white noise generators.
       
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    18. Gb3

      Gb3 Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      12/19
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Sshl
      Which study?
       
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    19. BadNeighbors
      In pain

      BadNeighbors Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2020
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      loud noise/construction
      I have little faith in this being a treatment for tinnitus in the next 20 years.

      Instead, this seems like it will allow those who are paralyzed to communicate via computers and move things via robotic limbs in the next 10 years. This is amazing and truly a marvel, but it is a far cry from adjusting the way the brain functions.

      It is my understanding--someone correct me if I'm wrong--that the Neuralink device only monitors brain activity, it doesn't change it. The Neuralink would probably be a powerful tool for someone attempting to understand tinnitus or or for someone testing the effectiveness of various treatments to alleviate tinnitus, but the device itself cannot get our brains to stop making these phantom noises. The device only listens to the brain, it doesn't change the brain.

      The idea that this is device will cure a bunch of brain disorders strikes me as almost as fanciful as SpaceX colonizing the moon, let alone Mars. The SpaceX rockets are an amazing feat for cheaply getting things into space, but the company is never going to take humans to Mars, despite Musk selling this story to the public.

      This is an interesting and easy to understand video on Neurolink discussed by a scientist who has accomplished amazing feats with similar but weaker devices:

      The Science Behind Elon Musk’s Neuralink Brain Chip

      Finally, this Herzog documentary on space colonization does a good job of giving Musk's SpaceX salesmanship a reality check, which I think provides a bit of context around Musk's salesmanship of Neuralink:

      Last Exit: Space - Official Trailer (2022)...
       
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    20. SmallRonnie
      Ape-like

      SmallRonnie Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      Ireland
      Tinnitus Since:
      H since 2018. T since 2021
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Loud noise
      Trust me, you don't want him gone.
       
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    21. KoolKat
      Dreaming

      KoolKat Member

      Location:
      USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      2013
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Headphone Noise induced ( BEING STUPID)
      Oh no, trust me I do, his money can stay but him... no... HECK NO.

      Even if he had the cure, I still would make absolutely sure getting it from him was the last resort.
       
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    22. lusiol
      Alienated

      lusiol Member Benefactor

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      2003 mild 2019 severe
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Life
      It was probably already said before but I even heard it was the opposite, Musk wanted to hire a whole new team for Neuralink because progress was too slow for him.

      He also wanted to invest on Neuralink rival "Synchron" who received FDA approval this year. Neuralink is still waiting for the FDA approval.

      Elon Musk is reportedly considering investment in Neuralink's rival brain chip company
       
      • Like Like x 2
    23. CW Dragon
      Conehead

      CW Dragon Member Benefactor

      Location:
      Midwest USA
      Tinnitus Since:
      07/2022
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Impulse Noise
      Doesn't his wife or girlfriend have tinnitus?

      Wouldn't be surprised if she was on this site if it's mild/severe/catastrophic - must be if it's public knowledge she has it.
       
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    24. lusiol
      Alienated

      lusiol Member Benefactor

      Location:
      France
      Tinnitus Since:
      2003 mild 2019 severe
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Life
      They are no longer together unfortunately. That said, they may stay linked, as she remains the mother of two of his children.
       
      • Like Like x 1
    25. @dam

      @dam Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      Australia
      Tinnitus Since:
      05/2022
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Most likely noise
      -brain-computer-machine-interface-ai-artificial-intelligence-conceptual-telepathy-link-neuralace.jpg

      The chip has read and write function.
       
    26. Ela Stefan

      Ela Stefan Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2018
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Ear Infection
      She has it mild/moderate so she resumed a normal life despite tinnitus.
       
      • Informative Informative x 2
    27. BadNeighbors
      In pain

      BadNeighbors Member Benefactor

      Tinnitus Since:
      11/2020
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      loud noise/construction
      What exactly does this mean? Monitoring the brain and then using those signals to tell machines to do X, Y, and Z seems like a reasonable goal as academics have pulled this off and it is time for industry to jump in and build upon this work.

      However, writing the brain sounds a bit fantastic and into the realm of science-fiction.
       
    28. Jerad

      Jerad Member Hall of Fame

      Location:
      Ohio; United States
      Tinnitus Since:
      2002
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Medication ototoxicity
      Why is Elon saying this will cure tinnitus within 5 years if that’s true - that it doesn’t really change the brain functions?
       
    29. Jupiterman

      Jupiterman Member

      Tinnitus Since:
      04/2022
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Sudden loud noise
      Elon Musk is a bit of an eccentric who likes to surprise people.

      I doubt he is giving away all his secrets as to how this innovative treatment works.

      Just be glad that the richest man on Earth, who has achieved great success elsewhere and has a great deal of resources, is working on helping all of us here.
       
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    30. @dam

      @dam Member Podcast Patron Benefactor

      Location:
      Australia
      Tinnitus Since:
      05/2022
      Cause of Tinnitus:
      Most likely noise
      Technically that's what E4. Shore's device is doing, zapping and influencing the brain. But her technique is extremely primitive as to what Neuralink will be able to provide

      Is it safe to suggest that if the Neuralink can stop / suppress tinnitus, it can also do a whole range of auditory things as such, play music through the brain, turn off your hearing completely, stop your brain from hearing loud sounds, etc.?

      Would love everyone's opinions.
       
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